By Stephanie Siek, CNN
(CNN) – The lawyer representing up to 6,000 African-American plaintiffs in an employment discrimination lawsuit against the state of Iowa says he will appeal a judge’s dismissal of the case.
"This was a step forward, but we're disappointed that it wasn't a bigger step forward from this judge," said Thomas Newkirk. "We will appeal it and keep fighting to expose the reality of how bias works in the system."
Iowa Fifth Judicial District Judge Robert J. Blink dismissed the case Tuesday, ruling that evidence presented by the plaintiffs did not prove hiring and promotion discrepancies between blacks and whites were caused by discrimination. But it also asked the state why it wasn’t using existing tools and policies to see whether it was fulfilling its goals as an Equal Opportunity Employer.
In a press release, Iowa State Attorney General Tom Miller praised Blink's ruling, calling it a "thoughtful decision (that) is based on the law and the facts of the case."
"The plaintiffs had an expert who testified that even if the agencies didn't know the race of the applicants, that somehow in a subconscious way they did know and discriminated against African-Americans," Miller said in a press release. "Judge Blink has rejected this claim as clearly as he should have."
The case, Pippen v. State of Iowa, was filed in 2007. It is the first large-scale legal case to argue that subconscious biases held by whites against African-Americans influenced decisions about hiring and promotions. It included 32 named plaintiffs, three of whom have since died, who said they were rejected for promotions or jobs with the Iowa state government and agencies between July 1, 2003 and the date of the ruling. Newkirk said there are currently 30 individual claims on file.
As evidence, it cited the Implicit Association Test, created by researchers to measure subconscious bias. A meta-analysis of test results from several different studies showed that up to 70% of white test takers nationwide, regardless of age, gender or self-reported attitudes of tolerance, showed a measurable preference for whites over blacks. This was the case even for people who considered themselves non-racist or progressive.
Newkirk and his legal team argued that if the test were given to hiring managers within the state agencies of Iowa, it would show roughly the same results and stand as evidence of bias that could have resulted in discrimination against African-American employees and job applicants.
But Blink said that there wasn't enough evidence to support that assumption.
Newkirk said Wednesday he plans to ask the state of Iowa to allow its hiring managers to take the Implicit Association Test.
"This case was about trying to expose the reality of how established bias is and how it can affect the equality of certain groups," Newkirk said. "African-Americans in particular have a lot of discrimination in their past. I think most people, regardless of whether they are conservative or liberal, would agree that there are currents of past racism that flow forward to today, but not everyone admits that.”
Beverly Couch, a plaintiff who said she was passed over after she applied for "hundreds" of positions and promotions within the state government, said she plans to be part of the appeal of Blink's ruling.
"I'm very disappointed, mainly because this is state government and state government should be an example for all – for the whole state," said Couch, who worked 16 years with three state agencies in Iowa. "Instead of being a good example, they’re fighting it."
What defines you? Maybe it’s the shade of your skin, the place you grew up, the accent in your words, the make up of your family, the gender you were born with, the intimate relationships you chose to have or your generation? As the American identity changes we will be there to report it. In America is a venue for creative and timely sharing of news that explores who we are. Reach us at inamerica@cnn.com.
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Here ya go....It is a huge cost to every American Tax Paying Citizen.
Google the first line for multiple sources:
$113,000,000,000 – This year's cost of US illegal immigration. Approximately 75% of that cost is absorbed by the states.
$1117 – The average amount you and your family paid in taxes this year to support illegals.
$52,000,000,000 – The cost of educating the children of illegals. This
is by far the single largest cost to the American taxpayer.
$2,700 – The average dollar amount a single illegal household costs the US federal government.
51% – The percentage of Mexican immigrant households that use at least one major welfare program. 28% use more than one.
1,400,000- The number of illegal immigrant households that use at least
one major welfare program. (food stamps, WIC, school lunch, Medicaid, TANF, SSI, and public/rent-subsidized housing)
The blacks will not be happy till this country is called US of Africa.
Actually we had a vote and decided to rename the country New Africa. Get your facts straight.
I believe the Hispanic should have the same right as the blacks. We are ready for a Hispanic President
When it becomes a presidential requirement then applicants will speak 2 languages fluently minimum.
-–GREED and WEALTH. This should help get a better candidate to serve OUR NEEDS right?
I believe Chinese should have the same right as the blacks. We are ready for a Chinese President
They would change our calendar year
All the blacks have to do is go to work for the USDA and they will get not only hired but trained and promoted bypassing plenty of vanilla folks for diversity!!!!! such a deal.
Seriously, it's news that people tend to prefer others that are like them? That's basic psychology, and always will be. You can't hold people responsible for instinctive, subconscious feelings. What's important is how they react to them.
The most ridiculous case ever..
What's the name of the theory that shows how preferential black people are toward other black people? That also affects people negatively, but I doubt that suit would go forward either...
wow... a judge that actually did the right thing by dismissing this bogus case
The bad thing is that the perceived bias is usually the other way round. Blacks get hired despite being lesser qualified because they play the race card. This is sad, since the truly qualified people that have earned their job by doing the right thing are now seen as "preferential treatment" hires too. I would say, get rid of the politcal correct hires and treat everyone equal. Quality will float to the top and racism will diappear.
In a perfect world you statement would be correct, problem is, we are far from perfect.
AND In a non perfect world is where plenty of non perfect solutions
seem to thrive eagerly
Unless your name is something like Lakesha Johnson, or DeShawn Jackson, there's no way to tell what race someone might be on a job application.
That is what people use Linkedin for and Facebook. It happens all the time.
riots in iowa, riots in florida, get your protection ready boy's and girls it is coming, locked and loaded
Many of you blacks are probably more closely related to the rich plantation land owners than most white people are.
oh please. -_-
6,000 blacks in the class action? What's that? Every black man, woman and child in Iowa?... lol
more proof blacks are not equal to whites , they are always looking for the free ride.
It's not called a free ride, its called a fair opportunity.
Dumb dumb.
"The plaintiffs had an expert who testified that even if the agencies didn't know the race of the applicants, that somehow in a subconscious way they did know and discriminated against African-Americans,"
are you kidding me!?! the plaintiffs actually thought this line of thinking was going to stand? fact is, white people are turned away every day because of their color but instead of crying racism they go try to get a job where they're wanted.
I have been working for my current company for 7 months. My coworker is a black female who has been doing this job for 6 years. Why is she coming to me asking me for help on stuff she has had 6 years practice doing? This is why you don't promote based on skin color. They are not qualified to do the job they are given. It's called the Peter Principle. The Peter Principle is a belief that in an organization where promotion is based on achievement, success, and merit, that organization's members will eventually be promoted beyond their level of ability. The principle holds that in a hierarchy, members are promoted so long as they work competently. Eventually they are promoted to a position at which they are no longer competent (their "level of incompetence"), and there they remain, being unable to earn further promotions. Peter's Corollary states that "[i]n time, every post tends to be occupied by an employee who is incompetent to carry out its duties"[2] and adds that "work is accomplished by those employees who have not yet reached their level of incompetence."
Rod, I agree. My husband is a mail carrier in VA and there are now a total of 3 white carriers. My husband got the job because he is a retired Navy chief with a disability. They have different tests for whites and blacks before hiring. Whatever happened to hiring on merits and not justbecause ofcolorof the skin.
Yes I agree, but the racist affirmative action let's blacks take the dumbed down version of the test. How will they ever be equal? They never will, if they can't meet the same standard that white people are expected to achieve.
Have you ever seen state employees? They are primarily black women. At least here in Texas they are. I worked for the Texas Workforce Commission and I was the only white male in my office. There were no white females. A few hispanic females and the rest were black males and females. There were about 40 employees in my office. How many white people were turned away from this job or never even called in for an interview? I probably only got an interview because my name is Rodney and someone made an assumption.
These people need to relax. I am a white guy who lives in Texas and I get passed up for jobs all the time because I don't speak Spanish. Hispanics get many of the jobs here. Can i sue?
Does this ever end ???
"an expert who testified that even if the agencies didn't know the race of the applicants, that somehow in a subconscious way they did know"
Maybe we actually know the meaning of life.
Maybe we actually know why congress is dysfunctional
Maybe we actually know how to do time travel
I'm requesting a multi-million dollar grant to study what we don't know. I'll take it in small unmarked bills.
My ex worked in human resources. What most people don't know is some employee or employer with an agenda will purposely code an application as to whom to hire or not. Its not likely the company did not know. Its more like the plaintiff's cannot show that the company knew of their race.
I hear you! Why, my sister married a white guy who turned out to be a drunk, philanderer, abusive, neglectful, arrogant, dumb, capricious, and abandoned her their children in a venomous-snake infested, leaky cabin! Tell you what, no more white guys for us!
You were lucky to find ONE!
No, not annoyed but rather bemused and sarcastic. (Ironically, the brother-in-law in question was named Chris) I'm curious as to the source of your statistical pronouncements, as personal experience has not led me to such conclusions. BTW, I am a conservative WASP and evangelical preacher.
what makes me upset is the term 'unconscious bias' so now i can be racist without knowing it? this is why hatered is in america b/c of these idiots.
Racism only exists because black people won't let it go. Anything that happens to them, they immediatly yell race whether intended or not.
"an expert who testified that even if the agencies didn't know the race of the applicants, that somehow in a subconscious way they did know"
That sounds like quite the expert. How exactly did the agencies "subconscious" "know" the race of the applicants? ESP?
Did this remind anyone else of Calhoun, the lawyer in the old Amos n Andy show?
not ESP. How about RIF?? As in Reading Is Fundamental. Right there, usually right under your name, next line on the application......ADDRESS !!!! Wow..........yeah, I can see how you went right for the ABSURD answer/reason on THAT one......
Deaf ears
Its about time a judge had some common sense.
Things have gotten better but there is a long way to go. We can't escape the fact that there is a wealth and opportunity gap between black and white Americans. This has nothing to do with hard work or intelligence but the fact that wealth is allowed to be passed on from generation to generation for white families at a time blacks were forced to work as slaves and treated as second class citizens. Many white Americans want all the privildges and spoils of their ancesters crimes and mistreatment of black Americans but want nothing to do with the responsibilities. Wealthy whites fight to pass on their wealth to their children so their children don't have to work as hard or have a 'good start' yet get outraged when as a country we try to right our past wrongs and provide programs to help black Americans.
Selfish, greedy, fear, insecure, xenaphobic white people on this very forum so worried that a black person may get a job simply because they are black. Yet they get angry when a black man sees time and time again white people walking around who were simply handed money and given great opportunities just because their daddy or mommy is well off. Fact is if white Americans will be the minorities and will have much much further to fall when the time comes. Your tax dollars and money will never be enough to lock up all the people that are going to be there to turn the tables and "get theirs" from your children the same way hundreds of years ago blacks had little control over their fate.
In short... white people need to stop being such cry babies everytime a black person is trying to get a piece of the pie. Man up and realize that 8 out of 10 times the reason people are complaining about the way things are is because they straight up suck.
Jerk, not all white people are wealthy or handed down money from the cotton plantation.
But some how all blacks claim to have been slaves.
If there were that many slaves we could have built a bridge to Africa with them.
I had no wealth passed on to me. I just had parents who completed school and passed an unbelievable work ethic on to me. Never got any handouts or special programs to help us. This is just more lack of accountability and refusal to accept responsibility for one's actions.
Geez, you've broken my bleedin' heart!
Where do you want me to send the check?
Jeez; another malcontent that is envious of others' stuff. Here's a thought; you make a couple of million (through working, not handouts), and then leave it for your kids. Oh wait...that takes discipline and dedication. I forgot that you don't have time for that. Your 8th grade education didn't teach that.
So what that the wealthy leave $$$ to their kids. It's their money (or it used to be before O). You think it's because of discrimination? They have it because someone in their family earned it, saved it, and invested wisely.
Instead of crying about what you don't have, why don't you finish school, pay your dues, and then make your own mark? Oh, I forgot. You want to take everyone else's mark.
I don't feel sorry for you. I just pity you because you are such a miserable bonehead.
Yes you are free to stay on welfare.
The human race is never going to stop Lookings at skin color. The war on race will be here when those on this post are dead. It is a never ending fight. Fair is what some may look at and some look at it as being lazy. We all need to look in the mirror and make a change. Stop putting each other down to make yourself look good. How many on this post has helped a family who is really in need that is not your color. Just think about it.
Mark,
What you are describing is "economic" disadvantage, not racial disadvantage. You need to understand the difference. A lot of poor white folks in the same boat as a lot of blacks. Why aren't you complaining about how they don't have it fair either?
Mark needs to "man up" and study harder, work harder and stop blaiming others for his failures.
Well said !
Nice job there Mark.. Hit 'em with where it hurts........The Truth!! See.................Words (truth) DO hurt !!! lol
I wonder what the Implicit Association Test results are with non-white groups. Does it still favor whites over others or does it show blacks favoring blacks, asians favoring asians, and so on? Is it discrimination or just a natural process to select something you are more comfortable/familiar with such as same race?
It would be inconvenient and racist to give the test to others. Why do you think it's always a one-way street?
actually in an article the other day on this topic they sited that indeed, other races also preferred whites over blacks. even blacks preferred whites over blacks in this test. interesting.
If that is the case – that each race tested prefers whites – is there possible inherint bias in the test? It is just that the results seem surprising.
One down in Iowa, one to go in Florida. Woo-Hoo!
A lot of people cant afford college or anything else so thats why they have Black, Latino, Native American..... and 20 other college funds or employee clubs for everybody except whites. Explain how that is fair! I'd be considered racist if i tryed to start a White Employee Club. Get over it.
Fair is to be unfair to white people for having slaves. Make white people pay for it. For ever. That's what makes it fair. Sounds like black logic.
There have actually been several schools (former students of school) who have tried to establish a scholarship for white students. One of the more recent ones was Roger Williams University, a former student stated that although he did not disagree with the right for any race to have a scholarship, he believed that every race should have one or there should be no racially biased scholarships at all.
Again, another overgeneralizing sweeping comment without any merit or real substance. If you have ever spent time with Iowans you would find very open minded nin bigoted people. Clearly your peanut gallery remarks are oversimplified by your lack of understanding and overall ignorance.
lmao....
Please do your homework.... Obama won Iowa. Think about that before you comment about Iowa citizens....
Wow, get real!!!
You mean the people in the same state that voted for Obama in 2008? Really???
White is Right. Not Correct – Just Right. Way Right. Way, way Right.
Do they still have slaves? Doesn't Iowa lead the way to the presidency? What happened there?
"But it also asked the state why it wasn’t using existing tools and policies to see whether it was fulfilling its goals as an Equal Opportunity Employer."
Because then it would be proof of discrimination.
What a stupid question.
Because, an educated black person can apply for a job, but some person, for whatever reason, will hire a white non educated person. It happens more than you care to see or understand....
That was for Donna and all who think racism doesnt exist or think black people and all races should keep taking it, bye haters
What are you talking about? They get hired all the time as cooks, maids and nannies.
You all need to get real. Its people like you all that causes the racial tension we have in this country.
Um, it happens rarely. Most business hire the best for the job, notice that it is always the poor blacks that claim this. Get over it. After the black panthers issued a hit on zimmerman, they then want the rest of us to buy that they are mistreated and the victem, bull cookies.
What poor blacks are you talking about? And its funny how white people always try to comment on black issues but don't really know what we are dealing with. Please spare insensitive comments. Oh wait, thats not the white way.
Basically they are saying that even level headed professionals have a 70% chance of showing racial bias.
Inbreds on the other hand, have a 100% chance of making a racial bias. These people usually fail to get jobs that pay over minimum wage anyway so they take out their frustrations making low class derogatory comments about blacks on the Internet.
Thank you Jammaster, finally someone with commen sense, goodness how dumb people are really getting...Proud interracial dating support, lets wipe out these dumb genes once and for all...
)))
Our Southern people(White and Black) are probably doing thebest most are capable of doing with their "minimumwage jobs." Seeing these kinds of jobs are about all there is in the South, they do well to have a tumle-down shack/trailer house and a "Bubba" truck. Come down here and TRY living the way our people live. Then, maybe you would be fit to judge us all......
Actually that really makes sense, but the issue here is knowing you are qualified for a better job but your overlooked because of your skin. Just skin alone....this is an old topic and we as a society must find a better way...judge individuals based on their actions not lump everyone together and continiously hold a race back because of whatever reason, we must get passed this whole which skin is better beause ACTIONS speak about that...
You ever see a underqualified black get a position before a more qualified white person? It happens way more frequently now all for the appearance to seem "fair."
Your right a friend of mine was passed up for a position at a firehouse in Nashville b/c there was not enough minorities there. So they hired a black guy who is less qualified. Joe how is that fair?
if everyone was more preoccupied with making sweet interracial love instead of the same old, we'd have a much more united society.
Affirmative Action...is racism. It is specifically about race, not ability. Equal opportunity is just that, opportunity, not garuntee.
In most cases with blacks, it's more like, UNEQUAL OPPORTUNITY.
amen brother... ah sister.... ah whatever!!!
Affirmative Action needs to go away. You don't get a job based on your color, you get a job based on your skills and education.
Although I do not agree with affirmative action your statement is incorrect. Affirmative action is about ability. Affirmative action works like this..... All things being equal among applicants you must choose the minority (black hispanic female asian). A company is not required to hire a less qualified applicant just because of thier race. I agree that it needs to go away.
The only ones that are discriminated against are the ones that are qualified for the jobs but because of affirmative actions that the b la c ks like to use all the time and those that get the job have no business getting it because they are s t u pid but play the race card anyway to get their agenda across...
This cr** really tic's me off. Hire because of QUALIFICATION...not COLOR!!! Why the heck should a black person be hired...OR a white-Hispanic-Indian..or anyoje..be hired based on his or her color? Thats just not right..and It makes me mad enough to cuss but then the post would be deleted!!!!!! AARRGGGGGG
Donna, the article is saying that qualified blacks are being overlooked and less qualified whites are being hired.
Happens all of the time
Just as you get upset when less qualified people are promoted or hired before you, they do too.
If you'd read the articles prior to this one, the person who ended up being hired was a white without any of the skills or education, compared to the black woman who had a bachelor's and a master's as well as experience, with the skills necessary. BLATANT racist pick, and there is no arguing that.
That stupid, un-educatedwhite man Will WORK.....that is why he was hired.
Did those stupid blacks actually have an "expert" who said " that even if the agencies didn't know the race of the applicants, that somehow in a subconscious way they did know and discriminated against African-Americans"
If you don't put down your race then how are you identifying yourself? If the black Olympic sprinter Michael Johnson filled out an application, how would anyone know he was black?
I think blacks subconsciously want to be white. They just won't admit it to themselves. They want everything white people have so I guess they want to be white. They even want white women too.
Now if you could only find someone - or even something - who would want you.
Do those black people wear Panties, like I do?
Probably Whites, ones they can throw out once they become stained!!
Good answer. Does anyone else want to answer my question?
We all know black males wear boxers. Everyone can see them cuz they wear their pants around their knees.
The black women? They go commando. Panties are too much trouble to wash or take off when getting plowed.
we should have laws that prohibit same race marriages and only allow interracial marriages, that way all this racist baloney will be done and over with in some 50 years once everybody is nicely mixed. no more race card for anyone.
Don't pee in the white gene pool
Whaaat? We haven't even finished the gay marriage crap yet. Its too soon for that law. But the bleeding heart liberals can always hope.
If we did that, how would we create anymore nuclear physicists? Or beautiful women?
Not sure but i'll take the chance.
Actually, some of the most beautiful women in the world are because of two different races. Chanel Iman, Adriana Lima, Mariah Carey, Alicia Keys, Halle Berry, Jessica Alba, Shakira, Salma Hayek, Rihanna, Naomi Campbell, Vanessa Williams, Naya Rivera, (it hurts me to say this one but the Kardashian sisters).
cant trademark the name bubba...there must be a good 2 million of yous
Don't do that! No more NBA superstars!
Let me guess, the judge is white.
White and male, lol
One two strikes grounds for appeal. Haha! We need some chinese tyranny judges.
What negative words am I allowed to say about this guy jj?????
Great, just what I need....someone to sue me because "subconciously" I am a "racist", didn't "know it" and, didn't hire them. So now they get all my money? If any court sides with that idea, then no one will be getting hired or, not hired. If these types of lame-brained lawsuits continue to grow, they will just arm real "racists" with all the ammunition they need to enlist converts. Think you have it bad now, wait until that happens.
Ur a closet Klansman. LOL
Thought Crime! LOL
Yep. Gotta love that liberal ignorance, huh?
Whites prefer whites because they are the most boring people in the world! They all eat the same things, listen to same things, play the same things, interact with the same people. They don't want any change or diversity anywhere. Imagine living in a country with only white people. It is almost feels inbreeding or incestuous.
Not true, I love fried chicken and watermelon, collard greens and blackeye peas.
Yea, and stuffing, pumpkin pie, rare meats, peanut butter & banana sandwiches, white milk, and soup! Yummy!
If they eat all that fried food and mcdonalds its unhealthy. They should pay more for health insurance to cover the costs. I guess that's what obamacare is for.
I like you bubba!!!!
Didn't see much diversity in China. They are doing just fine.
Not fair the chinese get to have a country all to themselves and come to america too. Then they open ip filthy chinese restaurants in Washington DC to serve the black population and get no appreciation for it
LOL
The grass is always greener...
It isn't just Chna, try most of Asia...
6000 "plantiffs" should occupy the white house sidewalk. The welfare wizzard we have of this country is a communist. In china only one child is allowed. Have your pet spade or neutered. Currently in USA the English language is still first then secondary languages like spanish or french not street language which is also obvious during an interview, like the obesity of food stamps supplied by state workers.
That's an interesting point, Matty. Whether it's true or not is a matter of debate. However, IF a person matches that generalization and falls into your description, THAT'S THEIR RIGHT. They don't have to change their preferences to suit you or anyone else. If you have a problem with that, then it's just that–YOUR PROBLEM.
Is that too hard for you to understand?
Define racism for me? Seriously, most people cannot define it. I prefer Country & Western music and don't like rap crap – whoops, I mean rap music. Does that make me racist? The issue is no longer racism – it has to do with culture. The issue no longer has to do with skin color – it has to do with culture. I recognize that trash is trash. Some cultures are superior to other cultures. Disagree? Then you must support cannibalism as a cultural practice.
I actually agree with you the definition of racism has been stretched to a point of absurdity. I hear it used to describe prejudice against Hispanics. Since when is Hispanic a race? In fact its a generalization itself, lumping those from Spain with those in South America with those in Central american and those in Puerto Rico and Cuba as if one discrete racial group. I happen to detest the use of non-standard English by ANYBODY and hate what texting and emails and other ephemeral modes of communication have done to spelling and grammar. Frankly, I think my dislike of the use of non-standard English would be interpreted as some kind of racial prejudice. I frankly think that racist claims have gone too far.
Wouldn't be surprised about the cannibalism part or shrunken heads. Or dinner plates in their lips. Hehe!
If you read any of the research you'll find that black people prefer white people too.
There is scientific evidence that in 2000BC. White cavemen didn't want black cavemen in there caves. Also black african tribes used to eat white people.
Subconscious bias? It is so subtle that white people don't even know they are thinking it, yet some are so attuned to it they can discern it in others. Mostly blacks...with lawyers.
Only in America... was the judge male, female, black, white or white Hispanic?
OJ got a fair trial with judge Ito....lol
Ttayvon, kishawn, shaqisha, tangelo, disa and Nanci.....NEED NOT APPLY....
Yea, and no johns either... LOL!
As long as there is a humongous gap between whites and blacks in terms of education and lots of other areas, I can only grin at the claim they were "discriminated against".
Affirmative action at work. If you still don't get the job with hiring quotas, try suing. Civilization has just been set back 60 years...
The IAT may reveal subconscious bias, BUT... Everyone has some bias built in; we are hardwired to identify with those like ourselves, and this bia is not unique to any race or culture. The fact that bias is present is hardly news, but under the law it is actions that matter. It would be quite a leap to prosecute people for thoughts as opposed to actions. Racism or bias is unjustifiable, but unless it is acted on I fail to see the legal justification for this case. Can we charge someone for thinking about robbing a bank?
"The plaintiffs had an expert who testified that even if the agencies didn't know the race of the applicants, that somehow in a subconscious way they did know and discriminated against African-Americans"
How stupid are these people to claim that they are being discriminated against subconsciously? Do they think the people who aren't hiring are psychic? Maybe it's because their applications prove that they are virtually illiterate and obviously challenged? Just a guess.
Sounds like they performed their hiring and promotional practices based on the the qualifications of the applicants. Perhaps those complaining should better qualify themselves.
"...to see whether it was fulfilling its goals as an Equal Opportunity Employer."
But blacks don't want equal opportunity, they want superior opportunity.
Actually, I think many of them WANT to be rejected for the job because they know that they can scream "discrimination" and win lots of money in a lawsuit.
You appear to be suffering from delusions of grandeur. As if the entire population of Black Americans, who seek employment, have absolutely nothing better to do with their time than to seek ways to fail and blame whites. Think about what you say before you speak. Your lack of thoughtless verbiage only makes you appear incompetent.
I'm OK with your silly accusations, Yoger. However, I'm not the one expecting to be handed a job and screaming "discrimination" even though I'm not qualified. If these people are so "stoo-pid" as to think that they are being discriminated against "subconsciously" and can file a lawsuit as result, then how qualified are they, really? They aren't. They just want to be handed a job.
BTW, Yoger, I'm looking for where I said "the entire population of black Americans". I said "many of them". You don't read so well, do you? Gosh, you almost sound "incompetent".
Thank you for pointing out the typo. If all you can do is take issue with a typo in my statement, then you've obviously gotten my point. My point still stands.
"But it also asked the state why it wasn’t using existing tools and policies to see whether it was fulfilling its goals as an Equal Opportunity Employer."
In other words, meeting the black hiring quota.
No quotas; but it is to make sure ALL individuals have a fair shot at employment opportunities and not shut out people because of differences in race, religion, color, creed, etc... Also Equal Opportunity helps to combat rampant issues with nepatism (where individuals exclusively hire of friends, family, special interests groups, etc.).
Of course there are quotas. They might not be called that, but it amounts to the same thing. They're supposed to hire a certain number of blacks, regardless of how unqualified or stupid they are. They just expect to be handed a job and a paycheck, even though they know they aren't the most qualified.
Then you need to educate yourself on Equal Opportunity. You also appear to be unaware of our great nation's checkered past, not so very long ago. There is a reason EO exists and it is not because of a bunch of whining black people, as your perception seems to be stuck on. You seem to have a problem with fairness and equality. Perhaps you are one of those people with the mindset of those in the days of segregation. You are sure coming across that way...
Actually it's nepotism "where individuals exclusively hire of friends, family, special interests groups, etc," not "nepatism."
Yoger, does EO require an employer to hire a black person even though they aren't the most qualified for the job? You obviously think they should be.
I wonder what the quota is for the job of "President of the United States?"
Let's see Henry... Go ahead and apply and run for the the position and let's see what happens... LOL!
Excellent point !!
How did they guess the race of the applicants?
Let me guess ... lack of qualifications? Maybe, just maybe.
Lets all move back to Africa then we wont have to worry about white racism anymore.
Marcus Garvey had the right idea. Booker T. Washington was another good black leader.
Unfortunately, they were sidelined and buried by the grievance hustlers, both blacks and their mainly Jewish advisers, lawyers and financiers.
Great idea Joe. Set the example and lead the way! Let me know how it goes!
Can we acknowledge that there are racists on both sides but because Caucasians are the majority, the statistical evidence showing racist ideology encompasses more people.
If there isn't racism in the world then the teen in TX who ran over a black man because he was black wouldn't have occurred. In addition there was the shootings in Tulsa, OK and oh by the way Trayvon Martin.
And don't forget the black vocational nurse in TX who killed a white woman then stole her baby. And the black kids that ganged up on an elderly Toledo man while screaming "this for Trayvon!!! Get that White man!!!"
Asians are the most "racist" people in the world, both in percentages of "racists" and absolute numbers.
Most interracial crimes are non-white on white. How many of those are racially motivated? No doubt lots.
Try yanking yourself out of the "hate YT" mode for a change.
Unqualified blacks complaining again?
zero
Funny to call blacks lazy when they picked the cotton, laid the train tracks and basically built this country on the backs of their free labor.
Shorty, don't you know things like BIAS, RACISM, HATE CRIME, etc. etc. can only be applied to Whites???
One more for the GOOD guys!
Woo hoo!
Im glad this was thrown out, it would open pandoras box for unlimited amount of law suits down the road.
Again, your prejudice, racism and racisl bias is bubbling to the surface. You are more than proving the point of this article especially trying to insinuate that blacks ar lazy. That is complete BULL! Blacks have had to deal with racism, discrimination and racial bias for 400 years in this country. True life is not fair, but life is also what you make it. I certainly will not allow you to make it unfair for me. Not doubt these plantiffs will win on appeal and I love it!
You are right, life is what YOU make of it, not how game the system.
If you are a manager and see someones resume and it says Malcom Johnson, or Tyrone Good or Tyric Miller, or Malica White please don't tell me you won't make the assumption that they are Black! If you see someone's resume that says Austin Powers, of Richard Blake, or Kye Justice or Laura Gore, you won't assume they are White. How do I know, I hire people all the time and can make that distinction. When I interview them by phone and listen to the cadence in their voice or in person I'm 90% right. If I were of the persuasion that blacks are no good or lazy or don't deserve a job, I would not hire them. Or would not promote them. That is a fact. However I have had the fortunate experience of hiring blacks, whites, latinos and asians. They have all turned out to be outstanding employees. Yes I have seen some who did not work out. White and black. But, most people if given the chance will do their best to get their job done. They just need the opportunity!
Yup, they're out automatically. Don't even want to know if they're black or not. That's too much information.
Most people will do their best, but the average level of "best" varies across groups.
Thank you for that. Your comment is actually offering light in the midst of a lot of smoking manure from people who are not really here to discuss or learn but just trying to be offensive, rude and provocative. It is masturabatory commenting, intended only for their own jollies and self-satisfaction with no real awareness or care of others existing in the world.
If you read the research that used the IAT, here is the general pattern: On AVERAGE, Whites prefer images of White people. Ok, on average. When you have African-Americans view the IAT, on AVERAGE, they show no racial preference, again on AVERAGE. What that means, and the research shows that around 50% of African-Americans show a pro-black preference, and 50% show a pro-White preference. The two divergent preferences cancel each other out...I wonder if the plaintiff attorney presented that data? I discuss this issue on day 1 of my Intro Psych class – to stir them up...and to point out statistic issues and selective use of research.
You have no clue how to interpret this data, do you?
Why in the world would you want to raise such issues in a classroom, on the first day too?!! Hopefully wherever you attend class and whatever you are studying, there is DIVERSITY!!! Bytheway, what sort of replies did your fellow classmates return?
The poster is the professor of the class, not one of the students.
Why not? To get people thinking...and put a mirror to their face, "Am I a racist as the IAT seem to indicate that I am? Or is this just some other artifact of the research?" To get students thinking doesn't mean "thinking comfortably". I'm not a student there, I'm the professor.
Exactly, the so called "test" should that people who do not have a racist bone in their body have a preference.... If the test was perfectly true that would show what? Human Nature?
In effect, this study,which no doubt was paid for with your tax dollars, were taken seriously then there can never be ANY defense in a discrimination case. If a non white is not hired or promoted by a black OR a white then it was discrimination.
I'm all for equal opportunity, and I am totally against discrimination, but this is floozy science. It sounds like manipulated statistics: correlations rather than causal relationships, not hard science. Even if it is somehow true that everyone is subconsciously biased, anti-discrimination laws require the discrimination to be active and deliberate – so "subconscious bias" doesn't count. Apparently there are still some competent judges out there.
Come on how can you be held accountable for unconsciously discriminating?
The very wording show no intent. Without intent there can be no illegal act.
Thus how can you be sued for discriminating without intent?
The judge was correct for throwing this out.
This logic is so incredibly dumb. You get into a car accident and kill someone. You didn't intend to but it happened. Yet you're still charged with involuntary manslaughter. Poor logic debunked.
Explain why?
I'm hearing the majority of what you all are saying.... Be sure to VOTE in November.
I'm a little skeptical of Beverly's racism card. If 70% of people are biased against black applicants, and she applied for "hundrends" of jobs (let's say 300 at a minimum), then that means she applied to 90 unbiased jobs (300 * (1 – .7)). I think 90 jobs is a pretty fair number of jobs to apply for. If you were turned down for all of them I think that's evidence that you're unqualified, the job market is extremely dry, or you're just plain doing it wrong.
Well stated. As always there are two sides to every coin and the plaintiffs can't have it both ways. If they're gonna assume that 70% are biased then they also must assume that 30% are not biased. There is obviously something else wrong with someone who is turned down for 90 unbiased job applications.
I live in Iowa and there is some truth behind this. I've traveled to New Orleans, Los Angeles, Miami, and other larger cities. The African American population here is worse than New Orleans. African Americans in Iowa seem to be addicted to the life media portrays them as. It isn't our state's fault. African Americans i've met elsewhere have better outlooks and don't put on a "gangster act." I'm a heavy drinker, so when I travel I make my rounds through each city haha.
Haha, and you appear to be drunk now! Haha!
Good points made already that the main argument by the plantif is the "meta analysis" of the IAT. To add to that, it's meta analysis. That is similar to taking the average of an average, which has been proven to not be as accurate as the original results. Also, great comment that this is "thought crime" very slippery slope here folks.
The truth hurts.
"even if the agencies didn't know the race of the applicants, that somehow in a subconscious way they did know" Is this guy crazy? How would they know-are they all psychics?
We're being tested for subconscious racism? Sure.
They sure are getting desperate for cash lately.
maybe if they spent less time protesting and suing everyone they could find a job.
flawed case!
Yes, Discrimination is alive everywhere. All races harbor some sort of bias against other ethnicities. I would rather hang out with my own race of course if given the choice, But the assertion that its systematic or directed specifically is improvable and improbable. There is always a good chance that when you do hire a color and find they don't work out very well that you'll be defending yourself in a discrimination law suit. LOL, That'll help get you a job for sure. LOL, Just sayin...LOL
Thats called posative racism and thats ok....well everyone tells us its ok, if a black man had shot an asian kid in a hoodie would we still be having this uproar, or an uproar at all?.....if it doesnt pass the mirror test then its racism in some form, against black, by black, against none white by none white....racism isnt just a white only persuit
subsciously was racist?...or did they look at the name of the person and it stood out as an african american sounding name
I want to see someone prove this statement..
"The plaintiffs had an expert who testified that even if the agencies didn't know the race of the applicants, that somehow in a subconscious way they did know and discriminated against African-Americans," Miller said in a press release. "Judge Blink has rejected this claim as clearly as he should have."
How the hell are you going to prove that someone subconsciously biased someone..
If the IAT is the best evidence you have to prove bias, you are in trouble. The IAT is not scientific. Because it is online and relies on self-reporting of demographic information, variables go entirely unmonitored and results are not reliable. If someone is tired, sick, has had too much caffiene, etc., the results will be affected because the test relies in part on motor abilities. While it is an interesting psychological experiment, anyone who thinks of it as objective science is kidding himself.
Where is the Rev. Al when we need him? It has to be about race it can't be about best qualified. The state of Iowa doesn't care if you know how to pick up a carcass.
In many (most?) of the cases mentioned it's obvious that the most qualified person was not hired and, in some cases, not even offered an interview. The question is why? When the manager doesn't even know the race (as in the case where the person wasn't even interviewed) it's hard to blame racism. Favoritism, yes, that can be blamed-but racism?
It is because people will more than likely hire people they know, went to the same college, from the same hometown and so on and so on. Why does it have to be racism?
Come on whistleblowers...do the right thing, and get paid for it. Iowa is one of the most racist states I have ever been too. If not worse than Mississippi, they are in the top 2. I'm not surprised at all that blacks doing twice the work of whites can't get promoted, in state or private jobs. Iowa is one big ol' boys club, that still allowwomen to be disrespected and discriminated against too. And black collegiate atheletes...you got 24 hours to get out of town, once your eligibility is up.
All states are racist. As a matter of fact, all countries, to some extent, are racist.
So, I suppose that makes it all ok, huh? America should be setting the standard for others to follow, but instead other countries laugh at us because we are internally struggling with the ability to learn to live and work together. Actually, I served many years in our great nation's military and I have been to many other countries and they do not have anywhere near the racial strife we have in our country.
Iowa Racist?
Iowa, first state to desegregate a public school, 91 years before Brown v. Board of education. http://www.iptv.org/video/browse.cfm/program/22261
Iowa, first female attorney, Arabella Mansfield, http://www.infoplease.com/spot/womensfirsts1.html
Iowa, Democrates nominate Barrack Obama as presidential candidate in 2008 and votes him into office in the same year.
Current University of Iowa President, Sally Mason.
Beverly Couch: Is that her real name or where she spends most of her time!
I agree with mohawk867, You're an idiot!! Get a job!
FINALLY!!! The race card SHOT DOWN!! So SICK and tired the race card trying to be played for laziness & free money~Go get a job & stop throwing the card out EVERY single time to try to get a free paycheck!!
You're sick and tired of hearing about it because you have never been on the receiving end.
I work with plenty of black people. I also know black people who are rich and sucsessful. Its how you apply yourself. It is NOT about RACE, its about education and willing to work. I also know plenty of white people who cant get a job as well. The race card has to end. stop blaming society on not getting what you want.
Dude, I doubt seriously if you know any black people. But there is no such thing as playing the race card if it really is RACISM! Paint your face brown for a month and see if you won't be playing the race card!!
intruth. yes racism exists. I myself was a victim of it. I being white dated a half black/half white man. My sister and her husband refused to let me be around their children while dating him because they didn't want interracial couples around them. But just because racism exists does not mean everytime someone claims it that it is true. And when people make it up it only hurts those that suffer from it going forward.
Amen, Pineal. And lady, you're going to keep hearing about it just as long as that damn elephant in America's room keeps getting in everyone's way. To put it politely, closing your eyes doesn't keep the train from hitting you.
Your use of "laziness" is indicative of what a racist would write.
ohhh because god forbid anyone be anything but ultra sensitive to racial and cultural differences. Racism isn't a plague on our society, people who run around shouting about it are.
Tortfeasor nailed it.
your and idiot
The facts are plain and simple...Blacks take more for society than they contribute. One out of every two Black men will spend time in prison. Ninety percent of Blacks will receive some type of government assistance during the course of their lives. If you take all the taxes that Blacks pay into the system and then subtract the cost to arrest, prosecute and house Black lawbreakers, then subtract the drain they cause on our social economic programs like food stamps, welfare, housing assistance and social security disability our country is deeply in the hole. There isn't a country in the world where Blacks pay their own way...They are a tremendous drain on the Worlds economies....PERIOD
You can't spell facts and you can't use 'em. Your "facts" are based on a centuries-long, systematic oppression of people of color - discrimination in employment, laws restricting their ability to vote, use public facilities, or get properly educated - and possibly most powerfully today, their isolation from the rest of American society as pariahs. And you know this perfectly well, but you're another one of these people who keeps closing his eyes and shaking his head and sticking his fingers in his ears while mumbling "no, no, no, no...."
Actually WHITES make up the largest numbers of people on welfare, using food stamps or getting government assistance. 70% of all pediphiles are white men. You seem to have forgotten to add that inconvient truth. It has also been proven that blacks are certainly more discrimminated against in the US judicial system than are whites. And your assesment that 90% of blacks are on some government assistance program is pure fantasy. Look go back to your hick redneck racist KKK sites. This post is for people with some kind of intelligence!
Does the test really "prove" an inherent racism issue, or that certain stereotypes may actually have a factual side? If the race of an applicant is not known, but racism is still prevalent, it would seem that somehow those taking the test would have been able to establish who was white and who was not, correct? Seems that would come from sterotypical names, jobs, words, etc, doesn't it?
Don't necessarily agree with the idea of filing suit over this, but I think that the idea of testing for this, etc, isn't something to be just pushed aside.
Oh, and shouldn't this be something coming from Georgia or Alabama? Aren't we the only states where racism runs amuck? You'd think so by reading the comments to most other stories on CNN.
Just another case of blacks wanting to be hired or promoted because they were black. Did you read this? It says they discriminated against blacks even though they didn't know their race. Does that even make sense? Lets say you send in your resume and don't get an interview. If you are white, you accept that. If you are black, you must have been discriminated against, even though nobody knew you were black.
Yep. And if you are fired, same thing
"The plaintiffs had an expert who testified that even if the agencies didn't know the race of the applicants, that somehow in a subconscious way they did know and discriminated against African-Americans," Miller said in a press release. "
This is a thought crime. All reasonable people should be disturbed that this is even being brought into our courts.
This case is double plus good. I can't wait to visit "The Ministry of Love."
You are exactly right J-Man another case where blacks complain about racism just because they didn't get a promotion. Blacks think they deserve everything just cause they are black. I am getting sick of it. They believe if something doesn't go in their favor it is cause it is some how because they are black. Totally ridiculous.
J-man if you see someones resume and it says Malcom Johnson, or Tyrone Good or Tyric Miller, or Malica White please don't tell me you won't make the assumption that they are Black! If you see someone's resume that says Austin Powers, of Richard Blake, or Kye Justice or Laura Gore, you won't assume they are White. How do I know, I hire people all the time and can make that distinction. When I interview them by or in person I'm 90% right. If I were of the persuasion like you that blacks are no good or lazy or don't deserve a job, I would not hire them. Or would not promote them. That is a fact my friend.
Just like peopel sueing the New York Fire Department for a "racially biased" test to get into the department. Everyone now doesn't want to earn anything and is looking for excuses. How can a test be racially biased? Are there some firefighter questions a white person somehow knows? Things are going to far now. I mean people can be sued for being subconciouslly racist now.
Then perhaps the blame should be placed on the parents for choosing such professional names as D'Andre Prince Ca$h Stevenson or Platinum Grillz Murphy...