.
December 27th, 2012
10:46 AM ET

Being transgender no longer a mental 'disorder' in diagnostic manual

By Moni Basu, CNN

(CNN) – The American Psychiatric Association announced this month approved changes in its official guide to classifying mental illnesses.

Among the major announced revisions to the manual, known as DSM-5, is that Asperger's syndrome will now be included in the diagnosis of autism spectrum disorder "to help more accurately and consistently diagnose children with autism," the association said in a statement.

But the group made another big change that did not make as many headlines, though it is considered by many to be important.

The new DSM eliminates the term "gender identity disorder," long considered stigmatizing by mental health specialists and lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender activists.

That old diagnosis meant that a man who believed he was destined to be a woman was considered mentally ill.

No longer so.

The new DSM refers to "gender dysphoria," which focuses the attention on only those who feel distressed by their gender identity.

"I think it's a significant change," said Jack Drescher, a member of the American Psychiatric Association group that made the recommendation after working on it for four years. "It's clinically defensible, but it reduces the amount of stigma and harm that existed before."

Drescher said there had been calls to remove the diagnosis altogether just as homosexuality was removed from the DSM in 1973. Drescher said he believes that removal changed world opinion on homosexuality.

But gender dysphoria was left as a diagnosis to ensure that a transgender person could still access health care if needed. Hormone treatment would be one example. Another would be counseling for those who need help dealing with their emotions.

Many LGBT activists felt that the gender dysphoria diagnosis could be a powerful legal tool when challenging discrimination in health insurance plans and services.

The National Center for Transgender Equality said it was pleased with the change.

"It will mark a significant lowering of the stigmatization that many trans people have faced," said Mara Keisling, executive director of the center.

"The changes help make clear that there is nothing pathological about having a transgender identity, and that the role of the mental health profession is to affirm and support individuals in being themselves in the face of societal misunderstanding," she said.

But others were not satisfied.

Transgender activist Kelley Winters, founder of a group calling for the reform of gender identity disorder, said the new DSM does not go far enough.

The new criteria "represent some forward progress on issues of social stigma and barriers to medical transition care, for those who need it," Winters wrote on her blog.

"However, they do not go nearly far enough in clarifying that nonconformity to birth-assigned roles and victimization from societal prejudice do not constitute mental pathology."

The greater issue, though, may be the larger sociopolitical impact the new category will have, wrote Dr. Dana Beyer, a public health and LGBT civil rights advocate who also served on the American Psychiatric Association's working group.

"Our greatest accomplishment on the Working Group was reconceptualizing the state of 'being trans' from a mental illness to a normal human variant," she wrote on The Huffington Post.

She noted that back in 1990, trans persons were lumped together with pedophiles in the Americans With Disabilities Act. The new DSM, she said, "finally brings trans persons into the light with the rest of the community of humanity."

Posted by
Filed under: Gender • Health • Who we are
soundoff (338 Responses)
  1. TGuy

    Not all transgender people want to have surgery. Many are fine with just dressing and living as the identified gender. Many more feel that hormone therapy is quite sufficient. Those who pursue surgery (and can afford to do so), are only able to get it done after having gone through substantial therapy and must have written statements from doctors attesting to their mental stability.

    December 27, 2012 at 9:53 pm | Report abuse |
    • Vetzero

      Not necessarily so. Depends on whose doing the surgery and where that surgery is to be performed. The United States and the medical profession here operate from the Harry Benjamin Standards of Care. Most western medicine countries do. But, not near so much, Thailand. Not near as many MDs use those standards there because of the culture in Thailand itself. The procedures used there are far less expensive and the quality of the process is first rate. Thai medicine isn't bad. A lot of their doctors are trained here and then they go home and apply Thai standards to their work. I would not hesitate to send a patient there for a consult and/or prep for SRS. Thai expertise in this area is second to none. Between a Thai MD and a U.S. MD in this matter ? I go with the Thais, everytime because I know their quality of work.

      February 27, 2013 at 11:59 am | Report abuse |
  2. notaposter

    Isn't this supposed to be scientifically tested? What chemistry in the brain makes a man a man, a woman a woman?

    December 27, 2012 at 8:44 pm | Report abuse |
    • asdhj

      Its called an X or Y chromosome

      December 27, 2012 at 11:37 pm | Report abuse |
  3. TGuy

    While you may believe that it is noble to euthanize "these freaks" for posting and spewing hatred toward people who are different than them, I cannot condone it. Such people who are shallow minded, lacking in basic empathy, lacking in the ability to communicate intelligently, are unable to understand that the world does not have to bow down to their personal truth claims, and refuse to consider that they may be the ones with the problem are to be pitied, not euthanized. Or, are the freaks that you are referring to the transgender population?

    December 27, 2012 at 8:38 pm | Report abuse |
  4. Moggarella

    Psychiatry used to be about defining "normal," and anything that deviated from "normal" was "sick." Over time, it has redirected its focus away from a normative definition of illness and is now focused on that which causes distress and interferes with functioning. That's probably why gender dysphoria is a mental illness but being transgendered isn't–one causes the patient distress and the other doesn't. But based on the comments here, it sounds like a lot of people want to see psychiatry back in the business of making misfits out of people, identifying and labeling things as "abnormal" and then locking them up. How enlightened.

    December 27, 2012 at 8:21 pm | Report abuse |
    • I won

      So if I want to cut off 1 of my 10 fingers, I'm insane. But if I want to cut off my one and only wingwang, there's absolutely nothing wrong with me.

      Yeah, right! No political correctness involved in this decision!

      December 28, 2012 at 1:42 am | Report abuse |
  5. Jane Doe

    @Carla,
    Transgender people where born into the wrong body. Male brain, female body, and vis versa. The cure is to match the body up to the brain. Obviously can't do a brain transplant(yet), so the cure is body alternations. Your logic is immature. But then again this is America, so we all have a right to our own opinion.

    December 27, 2012 at 8:14 pm | Report abuse |
    • Hack profession

      Read yourself! Astonishing. A male brain born into a female brain?! Is that something that medical and other biological sciences have confirmed with solid genetic evidence?

      You sound like some kind of hollywood science fiction movie. It is America and people with strange ideas are free to share them, but responsibly.

      You need to seriously think what you're saying. You've been conditioned by the gay political lobby.

      December 28, 2012 at 2:04 am | Report abuse |
      • kyla

        medical and other biological sciences has confirmed that physical looking males can have that of a Female brain/wiring And can even affect hormones.
        But that's not the only factor in being transgender, There is genetics where a person could be XX and develop as a man and same with being XY and developing as a Woman or even people that are XXY, But this is still just a small % on what can happen. There are MANY variations of gender, But we as humans get feed the same crap about only being Male or Female it's hard for us to see the variations in our self and others.

        December 28, 2012 at 2:35 am | Report abuse |
      • Larry

        Kyla, you're tripping, brother. XX can not develop into a male because she has no biochemical machinery coded for it. Number of X's is irrelevant (though you need at least one to survive) and one or more Y is what makes a man.

        December 28, 2012 at 9:54 am | Report abuse |
      • Wayne Fontana

        "There are MANY variations of gender"

        Well, if by "many" you mean "two," then you're right. Male and female.

        See Biology 101 for details.

        December 28, 2012 at 1:39 pm | Report abuse |
    • invisleg

      Good Land, what a demented lot the world has spawned. Can't one just hang out in mommie's closet and rub on her lingerie and leave the important work to adults?

      December 28, 2012 at 3:43 am | Report abuse |
  6. smitha

    I have been into crossdressing myself and it is for sure demonic as I now realise , I do not know hwy I did that but now i realise its futility , the urge was so strong and to get out of it really hard like you are under its control . sure there are a lot of things medics cannot explain and this is one of them sure it is demonic influence which gives way to the eveil of transgenderism.

    December 27, 2012 at 8:00 pm | Report abuse |
    • Jasper

      Cross dressing and being transgender are different.

      June 25, 2013 at 8:59 am | Report abuse |
  7. RJW

    You don't get to define "truth." Not arrogant much are you? I've never understood why people even care what other people do. Mind your own freaking business.

    December 27, 2012 at 7:33 pm | Report abuse |
  8. Steve

    Next thing you know they are going to say that members or the American Psychiatric Association are normal. Let's not forget the pedophiles, terriosts, and the democrats while we're at it.

    December 27, 2012 at 7:25 pm | Report abuse |
    • RJW

      What's your excuse for your mental illness?

      December 27, 2012 at 7:31 pm | Report abuse |
    • Susie

      Exactly.

      December 28, 2012 at 7:54 am | Report abuse |
  9. The Doug

    Being transgender is a disorder. Doesn't matter what all the PC folks think. Wanting to alter one's gender is beyond odd behavior.

    December 27, 2012 at 7:18 pm | Report abuse |
    • invisleg

      Yep. Anybody who wants to hack off their junk, split the remaining flesh in the middle to make room for more junk, or gladly let an equally mentally ill doctor slice slabs of skin off one's back, and attach a pig in a blanket to a hated gina may qualify as mentally ill.

      December 28, 2012 at 4:13 am | Report abuse |
    • Chantal

      Psychology and psychiatry don't exist to mold unusual people into average people for your bigoted comfort. In the world of those practices, a disorder is something that directly causes harm to the sufferer or other people. Simply feeling like a certain gender and being okay with that is not harmful to the person or society.

      December 31, 2012 at 11:06 am | Report abuse |
  10. Tyler

    Nice, so does this mean our tax dollars can stop paying for the operations?

    December 27, 2012 at 7:07 pm | Report abuse |
    • Charlene

      GRS was never paid for by the American Taxpayers or private insurance... Until recently with the Kosik case!

      December 27, 2012 at 7:18 pm | Report abuse |
      • Kenman

        Changes to include it have been made in several areas, California (land of fruits and nuts) of course.

        And, if you don't think that will ultimately be included in Obamacare, you're living in a cave! And, with Obama's "evolving" morals, who knows what else is coming?

        December 27, 2012 at 7:46 pm | Report abuse |
    • Jen

      Your tax dollars NEVER paid for one of these operations. They are never free and very expensive. The people who can afford them are very fortunate to be able to live as the person they feel they always were.

      December 27, 2012 at 7:18 pm | Report abuse |
    • LIla

      I agree with Tyler, if this is no longer a mental health illness then let's immediately save our tax dollars that at funding federal clinics to aid in transgender transformation. This was aggregious even when considered an illness, now it's just forcing my funding of lifestyle choices. Women can't get the specific meds they need in some of these agencies and only offered a select few generics but transgender persons can get ala carte hormones.

      December 27, 2012 at 8:26 pm | Report abuse |
      • TGuy

        I am not aware of any federal transgender clinics. All of my treatment has been through my regular family doctor, and all the medications have been paid for out of my own pocket.

        December 27, 2012 at 8:43 pm | Report abuse |
      • kyla

        A lot of people on this site commenting are very uneducated. Makes me very sad.

        Ps. Transgender people don't get anything payed for by taxes, The only time this has happen is in the case of the Woman in prison And we are as upset about it as you are. But then again many people in jail get better benefits then the people who has never done a bad thing in there life and has went to work in a dead end job all their life.

        December 28, 2012 at 1:50 am | Report abuse |
      • Wayne Fontana

        "A lot of people on this site commenting are very uneducated."

        Yep, and you're one of them, Kyla.

        December 28, 2012 at 1:43 pm | Report abuse |
  11. Stepnfetchit

    Psychiatry is kosher science.

    December 27, 2012 at 6:53 pm | Report abuse |
  12. esmiranda

    If you will never have male "parts" and you have a girlfriend, you are really just a lesbian. Sorry, but that's the truth. Why can't I demand to be referred to as royalty, or a pony if it's what I FEEL inside. You are delusional, and unable to escape the situation of living a lie.

    December 27, 2012 at 6:44 pm | Report abuse |
    • TGuy

      Dear esmiranda,

      You most certainly can demand to be referred to in any way you wish. I will not deny you that right. However, I must respectfully disagree with you. The lie (if that is what you must call it) that I lived was in living most of my life as a female. It would be wrong of me to assume that most people understand the difficulties associated with being trans. I'm not even asking you to understand. But I would ask for some general, basic human respect. I'm not so pie-in-the-sky optimistic or delusional that everyone will accept me, agree with me, or even tolerate me, but if I could have one wish, it would be for folks to realize that despite our differences, we are all pretty much the same – flawed humans that can live their lives in order to hurt others or to help others. I choose the latter. What does it matter to you that I am trans?

      December 27, 2012 at 7:08 pm | Report abuse |
  13. SingAPsalm

    Well CNN, you've done it again. Just when there was an article about President HW Bush, in which everyone who responded (including Republicans and Democrats) wished him well, it seemed that you were not satisfied. It seems like you enjoy seeing people insult and criticize each other. So you open this article about transgender people, which you knew would start some fireworks. The responses to these type of articles are always caustic and nothing constructive was accomplished. You are pathetic.

    December 27, 2012 at 6:41 pm | Report abuse |
    • Steve

      SingApsalm. Shame on you, you know nothing. Have you ever met a transgender person? I doubt that you have. And on top of that, you put down CNN. You sound pathetic.

      December 27, 2012 at 7:05 pm | Report abuse |
    • Hammer

      Absolutely right. Not to mention how they drag up Newton every day, exploiting those poor children for their own political agendas. There is something seriously wrong with CNN's management.

      December 27, 2012 at 7:09 pm | Report abuse |
      • Kenman

        They're LIBERALS, and that IS and always will be a disorder!

        December 27, 2012 at 7:47 pm | Report abuse |
  14. Robert

    And what about the stigmatization and societal prejudice of Schizophrenia? How come they they don't pull that off the list either? Why give special exception to trans folks?

    December 27, 2012 at 6:24 pm | Report abuse |
    • Moggarella

      Transgendered people aren't being given a "special exemption" because of stigma. It's slowly dawning on the medical community that people who feel fine and are doing fine aren't sick and shouldn't be diagnosed with mental disorders. People suffering from the symptoms of schizophrenia generally do not feel fine and are not doing fine, which is why they are still considered mentally ill.

      December 27, 2012 at 9:11 pm | Report abuse |
      • TGuy

        Thank you, Moggarella. Well said. I feel fine. I'm doing fine. I'm happy, loved, and fulfilled. I'm about to start my final semester of graduate school, and am hopeful about the future. These are not signs of mental illness.

        December 27, 2012 at 9:17 pm | Report abuse |
  15. Tom

    There is no way I will ever agree with trans genders being "normal" on the contrary, I think it's a profound mental disorder.

    December 27, 2012 at 6:20 pm | Report abuse |
    • Thomas

      Good thing the medical community does not follow your opinion.

      Maybe the DSM-6 will be based solely on the opinions of internet forum posters?

      December 27, 2012 at 6:22 pm | Report abuse |
      • esmiranda

        If people can choose their own gender, why can't we choose to claim to be a creature of another species? Why is it okay for you to pick and choose your reality despite the actuality of physical reality, yet I cannot? Strange world we live in.

        December 27, 2012 at 6:47 pm | Report abuse |
      • Moggarella

        "Maybe the DSM-6 will be based solely on the opinions of internet forum posters?"

        The Onion needs to get right to work on this. Like, yesterday.

        December 27, 2012 at 8:54 pm | Report abuse |
    • Charlene

      Tom.... Maybe your just not normal! I know I am...

      December 27, 2012 at 7:20 pm | Report abuse |
  16. Michelle

    I met her in a club down in old Soho Where you drink champagne and it tastes just like cherry-cola [LP version: Coca-cola] C-o-l-a cola She walked up to me and she asked me to dance I asked her her name and in a dark brown voice she said Lola L-o-l-a Lola lo-lo-lo-lo Lola

    Well I'm not the worlds most physical guy But when she squeezed me tight she nearly broke my spine Oh my Lola lo-lo-lo-lo Lola Well I'm not dumb but I can't understand Why she walked like a woman and talked like a man Oh my Lola lo-lo-lo-lo Lola lo-lo-lo-lo Lola

    Well we drank champagne and danced all night Under electric candlelight She picked me up and sat me on her knee And said dear boy wont you come home with me Well I'm not the worlds most passionate guy But when I looked in her eyes well I almost fell for my Lola Lo-lo-lo-lo Lola lo-lo-lo-lo Lola Lola lo-lo-lo-lo Lola lo-lo-lo-lo Lola

    I pushed her away I walked to the door I fell to the floor I got down on my knees Then I looked at her and she at me

    Well that's the way that I want it to stay And I always want it to be that way for my Lola Lo-lo-lo-lo Lola Girls will be boys and boys will be girls It's a mixed up muddled up shook up world except for Lola Lo-lo-lo-lo Lola

    Well I left home just a week before And I'd never ever kissed a woman before But Lola smiled and took me by the hand And said dear boy I'm gonna make you a man

    Well I'm not the worlds most masculine man But I know what I am and I'm glad I'm a man And so is Lola Lo-lo-lo-lo Lola lo-lo-lo-lo Lola Lola lo-lo-lo-lo Lola lo-lo-lo-lo Lola

    December 27, 2012 at 6:13 pm | Report abuse |
    • Autumn

      Way to contribute!

      Does making fun of other people help you deal with your own insecurities or are you just trying to be mean?

      December 27, 2012 at 6:15 pm | Report abuse |
      • Michelle

        Whose making fun? I'm in the same boat. That's my theme song. I forgot to change my name to Ray though.

        December 27, 2012 at 6:20 pm | Report abuse |
      • jim jimson

        Why don't you get that stick out of your a ss?

        December 27, 2012 at 6:21 pm | Report abuse |
      • Michelle

        I hope you're doing ok, this is a good day.

        December 27, 2012 at 9:12 pm | Report abuse |
    • Autumn

      Michelle – if you were in the same boat you probably wouldn't be singing that as your theme song. Lola wasn't a man. That's the whole point.

      December 27, 2012 at 6:25 pm | Report abuse |
      • jim jimson

        Actually the WHOLE point of the song is that Lola WAS a man. Try learning to read...

        December 27, 2012 at 6:32 pm | Report abuse |
      • Michelle

        Belive me I'm in the same boat. I get hassled by idiots like these posters once a while. I even like Money for Nothing, not a millionaire yet but trying. I just wished I signed in as Ray then I would have pasted his answer to that song too. To answer your below question about the haters, they are mostly trolls.

        December 27, 2012 at 7:01 pm | Report abuse |
  17. Robert

    Better to classify EVERYTHING as a "normal human variant". Nothing is abnormal. Infinite Diversity in Infinite Combinations.

    December 27, 2012 at 6:09 pm | Report abuse |
  18. Georgey

    Hey – If they changed all of the mental disorders to normal in the DSM, they can claim that they have cured all mental illness!

    December 27, 2012 at 6:08 pm | Report abuse |
  19. pjusa

    Unfortunately for the human race life has become much too easy and medical science has become very good at saving lives. More and more genetically marginal humans are living long enough to reproduce (naturally or unnaturally). This is rapidly diluting and weakening human gene pool. Fear not, natural order will be restored after the next apocalypse.

    December 27, 2012 at 6:05 pm | Report abuse |
    • Autumn

      "Genetically marginal humans" !?!?!?

      Are you serious?

      So you must think its genetic in which case you must realize its not a choice. In that case you must be no better then a racist who believes whites are genetically superior to blacks (I mean come on, just look at who was smart enough to grab all the money and resources).

      It's people who think like you that are diluting the gene pool not me!

      December 27, 2012 at 6:11 pm | Report abuse |
  20. Robert

    And tell me why Schizophrenia cannot ALSO be classified as a "normal human variant"?

    December 27, 2012 at 6:03 pm | Report abuse |
  21. Ed

    I just love how the moderators of this site practice freedom of expression by there censoring certain posts and not allowing a post that they don't want posted. Nothing like journalism attempting to shape public opinion vs just reporting it! Journalists are synonymous with politicians.

    December 27, 2012 at 6:02 pm | Report abuse |
    • Thomas

      Yeah, it is like this site is owned by a private company or something. Imagine, the owners of this site making rules for their own forum. What nerve, huh?

      December 27, 2012 at 6:18 pm | Report abuse |
  22. Autumn

    So now the APA and the DSM are a "sham" and a "joke" and "junk science"? For years the same hatemongers have used these same authorities against the trans community and now all of a sudden it's not credible?!?!?

    You haters are rediculous!

    December 27, 2012 at 6:02 pm | Report abuse |
  23. Autumn

    Why do the vast majority of the people commenting hate me so much? As a trans woman I assure you I suffer from numerous mental illnesses such as depression and anxiety, but they are all caused by the prejudice and hate I deal with. Why do so many of you care so passionately about this topic? If you're not trans or close to a trans person or a mental health provider who works with trans people you really have no idea what you're talking about. Why do you spread such hate? Why do you purposely try to harm other people? Trust me, your horrible judgments and nasty comments are felt and cause undo harm without any real benefit to yourself. And you say I have the mental illness? You have the audacity to call me a sinner when Jesus' only commandment was to love other people?

    December 27, 2012 at 5:57 pm | Report abuse |
    • Robert

      Don't suffer these people. There are so many people in the world in a hurry to get upset over something especially many of the small minded people commenting here. Life is too short to suffer fools, or not find joy in your life. I too don't understand why some selfish people try to deny others happiness.

      December 27, 2012 at 6:38 pm | Report abuse |
    • LIla

      It's difficult not beng a mental health professional being forced to take part in your transformation care. As a christian I wouldn't treat badly but as a person how do you take a stance to not have me threatened if I refuse to take part in your lifestyle choice. Is your belief supposed to be of greater importance than mine? If I don't agree with your beliefs that shouldn't label me as a bigot; why just as a person with another opinion. Healthcare is a right but this is now being labeled as something else

      December 27, 2012 at 8:43 pm | Report abuse |
    • invisleg

      Depression nor anxiety are mental illness. The community of mental health 'professionals' is a scam.

      December 28, 2012 at 4:33 am | Report abuse |
  24. Lou Cypher

    This is the problem with pseudoscience disguised as the DSM.
    One day a symptom-cluster is a "disease", the next day it isn't.
    Truth is, the whole thing is bunk.

    December 27, 2012 at 5:57 pm | Report abuse |
  25. atom1

    This is significant because most of the problems caused in society are done by those that try to impose their beliefs on others and make them conform. Many people that are different are not allowed to simply "BE". Whether you are a woman, gay, transgender, disabled or just plain different, why do so many feel compelled to force people who are different to conform to society's "norms".

    People who are different are just being who they were born to be. And those who has a problem with people who are different, and hate and bully them are just that - bullies and haters! So pathetic! If only we could get rid of these bullies and haters, the world would be much, much better place. (sigh)

    December 27, 2012 at 5:32 pm | Report abuse |
    • Big Bob

      Funny, but somehow, I bet you would would classify young males who are active in the classroom as the bullies and the haters. Fear not, the schools and the drug companies are drugging them into zombies. What once were destined to become
      real contributors to society will live with their parents into middle age. Societies "Norms" seem to be changing.

      December 27, 2012 at 5:47 pm | Report abuse |
      • phearis

        You sound like you speak from experience there Bobby.

        December 27, 2012 at 5:57 pm | Report abuse |
      • Michelle

        I won't argue with you, i see kids all the time, somtimes 10 yo, on heavy duty prescription drugs, sometimes 3 drugs.

        December 27, 2012 at 7:08 pm | Report abuse |
    • LIla

      Aren't you doing the same thing; if someone doesn't believe as you do you attempt to bully, shame or yell louder to make your opinion/stance/choice accepted. In spite of that I would never wish some vile action to be taken against you.

      December 27, 2012 at 8:48 pm | Report abuse |
    • Hack profession

      And you must be a tween or millennial. Haters and the use of such a word is always connected with immaturity, and lack of life experience. Which you certainly sound like you LACK.

      If only you KNEW just how much bigotry there is IN the gay community against what they call "norm" people as "BREEDERS" and so on, why should we also change for them?

      Bunch of hypocrites, you and them.

      December 28, 2012 at 2:07 am | Report abuse |
    • invisleg

      Kinda like the people who force their twisted perverse lifestyle on others and call it normal?

      December 28, 2012 at 4:39 am | Report abuse |
  26. lance corporal

    I don't get the transgender thing, I really don't.

    good thing we don't base our laws on every thing I don't understand or disagree with.
    if we did alcohol and a lot of other things MANY people like would be illegal.

    I guess even tho I don't get it I can just live and let live and assume that someone may not like an aspect of my life and I certainly appreciate it if they leave me to live as i please as long as I'm not hurting anyone either.

    December 27, 2012 at 5:27 pm | Report abuse |
    • Steve

      That's an admirable way to look at things.

      December 27, 2012 at 5:31 pm | Report abuse |
    • atom1

      lance corporal. very mature of you. You are a good example of an excellent citizen. What a simple concept - As long as no one, no animal is harmed, then live and let live.

      December 27, 2012 at 5:38 pm | Report abuse |
      • invisleg

        Be sure to put his Brownie Button in the mail ASAP!

        December 28, 2012 at 4:41 am | Report abuse |
    • str8whtguy

      Well-said. I absolutely hate onions, but that's no reason to stop anyone else from eating them. Maybe my analogy is a stretch, but I think it makes a point.

      December 27, 2012 at 5:47 pm | Report abuse |
      • franksonbi2

        "I absolutely hate onions, but that's no reason to stop anyone else from eating them."

        But if the APA claimed onions weren't onions because it hurts someone's feelings to call onions onions - that would be a problem. That is, it would be a lie. You're opposed to lying, aren't you?

        December 27, 2012 at 5:54 pm | Report abuse |
    • Michelle

      I assure you they have died in battle for our country. I almost signed up for sea duty in ' 84 but chose to live how I wanted. I was even down for the physical, the recruiter was po'd.

      December 27, 2012 at 7:14 pm | Report abuse |
  27. Fred M.

    Okay, would you consider at least getting a vasectomy if we all chipped in for it? That would be a sort of chlorine for the gene pool.

    December 27, 2012 at 5:25 pm | Report abuse |
  28. rafael

    Do you cut your hair? Your bible says you shouldn't.

    December 27, 2012 at 5:24 pm | Report abuse |
    • franksonbi2

      Who cares what the Bible says? I'm an atheist.

      December 27, 2012 at 5:46 pm | Report abuse |
  29. lance corporal

    hate, more hate, judgement, condescension, threats of violence and eternal damnation.......

    ya know what i always say about ANYTHING that is related to ANY se xuality other than my own

    December 27, 2012 at 5:23 pm | Report abuse |
    • Kim

      Thank you for saying what I was thinking . . . now, would you please tell my boyfriend's 31-year-old gay daughter that she has no right telling her dad who she can see, especially given that she moved to Washington five years ago and still hasn't bothered to come out to him? Tell her I'm sorry she and her sister are so insanely jealous of me and my children.

      December 27, 2012 at 5:40 pm | Report abuse |
  30. Ben

    Is this progress or bowing to "progressives?"

    December 27, 2012 at 5:18 pm | Report abuse |
    • rafael

      If you were transgender, what would you think? Try empathy.

      December 27, 2012 at 5:21 pm | Report abuse |
      • rafael

        @pooki: that's called sympathy. You badly need a dictionary.

        December 27, 2012 at 5:24 pm | Report abuse |
      • giveup

        It's a mental illness whether we're empathetic or not. Ditto schizophrenia.

        December 27, 2012 at 5:43 pm | Report abuse |
      • phearis

        Mental Illness huh? hmmm, Ya know, the same thing could be said about people who believe in this extremely antiquated book that many churches around the US seems think perfectly fine to shove down people's throats.

        December 27, 2012 at 6:02 pm | Report abuse |
  31. jharwo

    Your right it's not a mental illness, it's a sickness and a sin, don't mess with what God created.

    December 27, 2012 at 5:15 pm | Report abuse |
    • CottonConcrete

      A sin? Ahhhh, so Im guessing youve never eaten just a bit too much or told only half of the truth or withheld the truth to avoid confrontation. Or how bout wearing makeup and dressing up? Im sure youve never done any of those things. Surely not with your "dont mess with what God created theory....next.

      December 27, 2012 at 5:17 pm | Report abuse |
    • rafael

      Your god didn't create anything, so no harm no foul.

      December 27, 2012 at 5:22 pm | Report abuse |
    • atom1

      Judge Much?

      December 27, 2012 at 5:42 pm | Report abuse |
    • Al Br

      What a very shallow and ignorant thing to say. This condition is a birth defect–a person is born with an incomplete gender association (mentally and physically in many cases). This has nothing to do with sin...unless, of course, you are implying that God is forcing people to be born with conditions that condemn them to Hell, even before they are able to make choices between right and wrong.

      December 27, 2012 at 5:47 pm | Report abuse |
      • son of a doctor

        That's just simply incorrect. It has nothing to do with birth or genetics; it is the result of physcological trauma. This is why children raised by gay couples even if adopted become gay more often than those with one father and one mother. Nonetheless, being gay or gender confused is still not an active choice; you are simply incorrect by saying it is decided at birth when in reality the issue is rooted in one's childhood.

        January 5, 2013 at 3:27 am | Report abuse |
    • phearis

      Romans 2:1 – You, therefore, have no excuse, you who pass judgment on someone else, for at whatever point you judge another, you are.

      hmmmmm, seems to me that any Christian who passes judgement on someone is in fact, committing a sin. *wink*

      December 27, 2012 at 6:07 pm | Report abuse |
  32. CottonConcrete

    I am astounded that so many people get fired about this subject. If you, yourself, are not transgender, why in the world would you care what is considered a mental illness and what isn’t. Come on folks.

    December 27, 2012 at 5:06 pm | Report abuse |
  33. Ignominious

    Has psychology ever been a real science? Not too long ago lobotomies were a main stream procedure by these "doctors".

    You can bet that "normal" behavior will become more and more a condition that needs treatment.

    December 27, 2012 at 4:58 pm | Report abuse |
    • Fred M.

      "You can bet that "normal" behavior will become more and more a condition that needs treatment."

      Then no treatment for you.

      December 27, 2012 at 5:30 pm | Report abuse |
  34. Dubious

    American Psychiatric Association must be needing more clients. They are apparently a group of nutcases. Psychiatrists are actually M.D. s that went on to specialize? Geeze.

    December 27, 2012 at 4:58 pm | Report abuse |
  35. blacknight811

    For anyone posting all of the mean and negative comments about transgendered people, my question is do you have a transgendered friend or have you spent any significant amount of time with a transgendered person before?? If the answer is no then your opinions don't really carry any weight behind them. At the end of the day they're just people....regaurdless of what gender they identify as. It doesn't effect you one way or the other so why attatch your negative feelings to it??

    December 27, 2012 at 4:53 pm | Report abuse |
    • CottonConcrete

      100% on target here!!!

      December 27, 2012 at 5:07 pm | Report abuse |
    • Sra. Julia

      I have wondered the same thing over and over; why all the anger about something that doesn't effect you or change your life in any way? So why all the emotions?

      December 27, 2012 at 5:18 pm | Report abuse |
  36. matt

    Ahh, yes. Telling someone they have a mental illness makes them feel bad. So we'll stop calling it a mental illness.

    That's "science" for ya!!!

    Sorry, you can call crap a rose. It's still crap.

    December 27, 2012 at 4:50 pm | Report abuse |
    • Ray

      The DSM 5 has nothing to do with real science. Likewise for psychology... they pretty much make it up as they go along.

      Next on the PC agenda: adding more freaks to the cast of Modern Family so that it can win even more 'awards'. What the heck is happening to this country?

      December 27, 2012 at 4:55 pm | Report abuse |
      • Fred M.

        "What the heck is happening to this country?"

        It's becoming one where bigotry and intolerance are not considered acceptable behavior. Sucks to be you.

        December 27, 2012 at 5:34 pm | Report abuse |
      • Joey

        People like funny tv shows? OH the Horror!

        December 27, 2012 at 5:38 pm | Report abuse |
  37. HOPE for CHANGE

    We are in the 7th circle of hell.

    December 27, 2012 at 4:45 pm | Report abuse |
    • Sledge

      Dante would be so proud!

      December 27, 2012 at 4:52 pm | Report abuse |
  38. usajoe

    Don't want to cut anything off, just want access to the womens' lockerrooms!

    December 27, 2012 at 4:35 pm | Report abuse |
  39. factChik

    Obviously, psychology is no longer a science-, evidence-based practice anymore, as it appears to have been hijacked by ideologue zealots.

    December 27, 2012 at 4:35 pm | Report abuse |
  40. yabochuk

    PC nonsense is victorious over common sense once again. Great news for Napoleon impersonators though.

    December 27, 2012 at 4:25 pm | Report abuse |
  41. Tutuvabene

    So the APA practices psychiatry by popular opinion.

    December 27, 2012 at 4:24 pm | Report abuse |
    • factChik

      So much for science and quantifiable observation!

      December 27, 2012 at 4:36 pm | Report abuse |
  42. Hack profession

    Yeah... psychologists are a mental group themselves. Purely based on theory. A somewhat hack profession.

    They may feel its not, I think there are many that will continue to thin i it is. I mean, really... look at a trangendered person. C'mon. Be truthful... they are off no matter what liberals anywhere think. And i"m not a nut conservative either. I'm not religious one bit, but seriously.. SERIOUSLY.

    December 27, 2012 at 4:23 pm | Report abuse |
  43. Tutuvabene

    The outward appearance may change but the chromosomes don't lie.

    December 27, 2012 at 4:20 pm | Report abuse |
  44. Bill the Cat

    So, let me get this right... a known activist is on the very board that determines these things... and that is not a conflict of interest... how?

    December 27, 2012 at 4:18 pm | Report abuse |
  45. jess

    hannah, there's no use arguing with people who feel it is their responsibility to tell us what is right and what is wrong. luckily for us, their opinion clearly doesnt matter! :D

    December 27, 2012 at 4:17 pm | Report abuse |
    • Bill the Cat

      That's exactly what the APA does. They tell us what is "natural" and what isn't. With known activists on the very board that votes on them...

      December 27, 2012 at 4:19 pm | Report abuse |
    • Hannah

      Yeah I know, but I'm not really hear to talk to them so much as I am to talk at them. I've dealt with enough prejudiced people in my life to know exactly how successful arguing these points with them will be, but it may help some people who aren't so intolerant and closed minded to understand transgendered people a bit better so it's worth the time to humour bigots for that reason.

      One step at a time right? I'd like to think that education now might eventually make things better for people in the future who have to go through this, and even if that philosophy has been proven true in my own life at least. Understanding fosters acceptance, that's what makes these seemingly pointless debates worthwhile.

      December 27, 2012 at 4:34 pm | Report abuse |
      • Hannah

        here* lol... wow what is with me today, every post has typos ._.

        December 27, 2012 at 4:34 pm | Report abuse |
  46. watash60

    only in a liberals mind is this true

    December 27, 2012 at 4:16 pm | Report abuse |
    • Sylar75

      You missed the part of the article that stated there was one mental disorder added. Its call foxnewsdismorphic disorder. It means someone who watches Fox News and actually thinks thats how the world is.

      December 27, 2012 at 4:24 pm | Report abuse |
  47. xtra

    Some can say the same with tattooing, body rings, and cosmetic surgery.

    December 27, 2012 at 4:15 pm | Report abuse |
    • xxo

      Clearly, the mere fact that those who don't agree with YOU are mentally screwed up?? Maybe it's not THEY who are screwed up but YOU.

      December 27, 2012 at 4:22 pm | Report abuse |
    • matt

      We're talking about cutting off parts of the body. That's clearly a mental illness.

      December 27, 2012 at 4:48 pm | Report abuse |
  48. snowdogg

    It is all about "labeling" – meh

    December 27, 2012 at 4:12 pm | Report abuse |
  49. Clay

    Trans people claim that they are a man trapped in a woman's body or vice versa. There is no evidence for this. There is no way to demonstrate it or prove it. It is a claim that rests wholly on the word of the person making it, and the rest of the world is supposed to accept this claim at face value, and not only accept it, but go out of the way to subsidize it. If I claimed I was God trapped in a human body, or an alien trapped in a human body, or a dragon, or a faerie, or any number of things, I'd be considered crazy. But if I claim I'm the opposite gender, everyone is supposed to take me seriously.

    If trans people truly believe that they are a different gender on the inside, that is a product of their mind, not their DNA, and thus they can legitimately be classified as having a disorder.

    December 27, 2012 at 4:06 pm | Report abuse |
    • Larry

      Unless you got Tom Cruise to claim he was also the same kind of alien trapped in a human body. Then you've got a religious cult going.

      December 27, 2012 at 4:13 pm | Report abuse |
    • xtra

      And what credentials do you have that enable you to be the resident expert on the subject?

      December 27, 2012 at 4:13 pm | Report abuse |
      • F.O.X.024

        Does not need to be an expert to make that statement just have common sense.

        December 27, 2012 at 4:27 pm | Report abuse |
    • Hack profession

      Men trapped in a woman's body... or women trapped in a fema... I'm all confused BUT I will say this, just talking that there is a gender trapped in a body is in effect – CRAZY TALK. Kookoo... toys in the attic... lalala... wooopdidooo ...

      December 27, 2012 at 4:25 pm | Report abuse |
    • Bob

      Christians claim that there is an invisible all powerful man in the sky. There is no evidence for this. There is no way to demonstrate it or prove it. It is a claim that rests wholly on the word of the person making it, and the rest of the world is supposed to accept this claim at face value, and not only accept it, but go out of the way to subsidize it. If I claimed there was an alien in the sky, or a dragon, or a faerie, or any number of things, I'd be considered crazy. But if I claim there is an invisible all powerful man in the sky, everyone is supposed to take me seriously.

      If Christians truly believe that there is an invisible all powerful man in the sky, that is a product of their mind, and thus they can legitimately be classified as having a disorder.

      December 27, 2012 at 5:44 pm | Report abuse |
  50. sgurdog

    Anyone who still holds the same emotional beliefs they learned as a child will be left scratching their behinds when the world evolves around them.

    December 27, 2012 at 4:06 pm | Report abuse |
    • factChik

      You mean the emotional, irrational belief that if you say it over and over, you'll believe it and eventually others will too? Evolution and convolution are not the same thing.

      BTW- most things don't live the millions/billions of years, it normally takes for living things to evolve significantly. The species is dead and long-gone before change occurs.

      December 27, 2012 at 4:50 pm | Report abuse |
      • aash

        Eh? Alligators as a species are roughly 37 million years old, sharks as a whole go back nearly 420 million years, with specifics like the great white being ~16 million years old. But yeah, you're right, nothing lasts that long, I'm sure God just magically comes out with 'shark 2.0' somewhere down the line.

        December 27, 2012 at 5:25 pm | Report abuse |
  51. Daedalus

    No, you wouldn't be, and that's actually something a very few people do. To be fair, they generally want to amputate something more substantial than a finger. Personally I feel badly for people who want to change themselves so much, when the medical reality is that it's largely cosmetic. That being said, I don't think that it's worth concerning ourselves about in a world with much more pressing issues.

    December 27, 2012 at 4:00 pm | Report abuse |
  52. APAGuidelinesAreCrap

    Ok. So men wanting to remove their genitals and dress like drag queens is fine according to the APA. Apparently, they have a new leader and IT has driven this agenda. Watch out... NAMBLA is implanting their representative as we speak.

    December 27, 2012 at 4:00 pm | Report abuse |
  53. Kip Oliver

    But Bill, you also described those who have cosmetic and plastic surgery done to make them look younger, or give them bigger breasts...they mutilate their healthy bodies to change what Nature gave them. So...that's not OK either? And their suicide rate is up? And they also have a mental illness....like depression?

    December 27, 2012 at 3:59 pm | Report abuse |
  54. Michael, Chapel Hill

    The shadow of things to come. When it is inconvinient, psychologists may disown/judge incompetent/expensive an individual or group. Govt controlled healthcare can be lethal too.

    December 27, 2012 at 3:51 pm | Report abuse |
  55. sgurdog

    So I guess the medical community is liberal as well? I would assume that may be at least a few transgendered conservatives in America. Just because your little brain doesn't have the capacity to comprehend or your tiny little heart doesn't have the compassion to be tolerant to things foreign to your own philosophy, that doesn't make your opinion any more worthy of merit than those who do this for a living.

    December 27, 2012 at 3:50 pm | Report abuse |
  56. Hannah

    "become nothing more than a statistic for people like you"* Ugh... why does my brain keep skipping .-.

    December 27, 2012 at 3:44 pm | Report abuse |
  57. frank

    Ahh, yes. Telling someone they have a mental illness makes them feel bad. So we'll stop calling it a mental illness.

    Thats "science" for ya!!!

    Sorry, you can call crap a rose. It's still crap.

    December 27, 2012 at 3:42 pm | Report abuse |
    • SeeThruIt2

      But, just in case they still feel bad, we'll let them call feeling bad about their confusion a mental illness.

      December 27, 2012 at 3:47 pm | Report abuse |
    • texcal68

      Have you ever had a positive thought?

      December 27, 2012 at 3:48 pm | Report abuse |
      • frank

        Oh, did the truth make you feel sad?

        December 27, 2012 at 4:01 pm | Report abuse |
    • frank

      Another option: They put the truth over hurt feelings.

      December 27, 2012 at 4:02 pm | Report abuse |
    • sgurdog

      Science evolves, that's why it's not called a religion.

      December 27, 2012 at 4:09 pm | Report abuse |
      • frank

        This has nothing to do with science and everything to do with political correctness.

        December 27, 2012 at 4:13 pm | Report abuse |
      • xtra

        Science evolves is simply another way of saying science always proves itself incorrect at one point.

        December 27, 2012 at 4:17 pm | Report abuse |
    • sgurdog

      I would say that you're acting more hurt that your opinion is no longer considered the "truth" according to those who actually define it.

      December 27, 2012 at 4:12 pm | Report abuse |
      • frank

        A few people in a room voting on a committee don't "define the truth."

        Yikes.

        December 27, 2012 at 4:13 pm | Report abuse |
      • matt

        A few people in a room voting a a committe don't "define the truth." Yikes.

        December 27, 2012 at 4:51 pm | Report abuse |
  58. Huh

    Yay~

    December 27, 2012 at 3:39 pm | Report abuse |
  59. everything in Moderation

    I don't actually believe you, Bill. You'd have to state sources.

    Beyond that, you'd have to show how those sources are able to conclude that the suicides were based on what you say. People who have been tormented all their lives because they have the wrong body and their choices to correct it put them on the wrong side of judgemental people like yourself might be committing suicide or having depression based on THAT rather than any kind of malaise over their body being transformed to meet their mind.

    December 27, 2012 at 3:31 pm | Report abuse |
    • Hannah

      Very nice Bill, attacking them because they called you out on trying to argue for the side of "logic and objectivity" without actually providing any evidence to back it up totally doesn't indicate that you're talking out of your ass and basing your argument off of your own prejudice rather than genuine concern for people who are essentially born in prison. You're involving yourself in a discussion, not a fight, if you're asked to provide evidence then you'd better be willing to spend the extra quarter of a second it takes to post a link, otherwise you should keep your opinions (and that's all they are, opinions) to yourself. :/

      December 27, 2012 at 4:18 pm | Report abuse |
  60. Larry

    It's a rolling board. They clear all comments after a while, so keep posting and you might just have the last word when they lock the thread.

    December 27, 2012 at 3:30 pm | Report abuse |
    • Hannah

      Well, technically it's not being cut off, but rather cut in half, pushed inside, and reconstructed using the same nerve endings and much of the skin it had before. See? Not only do they not really cut anything off, but the surgery covers two of the three Rs, recycle and reuse! :D There, I expect your asinine opinion to change completely now.

      December 27, 2012 at 5:15 pm | Report abuse |
  61. laura

    You are an idiot, I suppose if you had been born with two penises or a vigina and a penis, you would stay
    that way cause changing your body would be wrong because you were born that way. All humans deserves
    respect and allowed to exist happily as they can. A person with gender dysphoria are normal people who just
    are not happy in the body in which they were born. I agree with HANNAHS WORDS ALSO.

    December 27, 2012 at 3:25 pm | Report abuse |
    • factChik

      Even if that were true, most people born like that wouldn't be DUMB enough to sit there and say nothing's wrong is this is NORMAL.

      December 27, 2012 at 4:51 pm | Report abuse |
  62. jonathanweeston

    You could legally marry a 12 year old in this country all the way up until the early 20th century. So, were all those people that married young girls pedophiles? Answer: no. Pedophilia is wrong not only because of how it affects the pedophile, but MAINLY because of the traumatic affects it has on young children. A gay man pursuing another gay man, who are both over the legal age, is not a mental illness, nor does it harm anyone involved in a mental or physical way.

    Try not using an inane argument and having a logical discussion instead of spouting off talking points you heard on Fox and The Blaze.

    December 27, 2012 at 3:23 pm | Report abuse |
    • Deb

      Here, here!

      December 27, 2012 at 9:15 pm | Report abuse |
  63. Larry

    If you have at least one Y chromosome, you're a boy. If you believe otherwise, you're a delusional nut job and need to be locked away in a sanatorium.

    December 27, 2012 at 3:20 pm | Report abuse |
    • Agree

      lol

      December 27, 2012 at 3:20 pm | Report abuse |
    • Doc's Wife

      I concur. "You can remove the penis and make a venus, but an XY will always be a guy."

      December 27, 2012 at 3:28 pm | Report abuse |
    • Sane Person

      You are wrong. Luckily, your uneducated opinion doesnt make a bit of difference.

      December 27, 2012 at 4:35 pm | Report abuse |
  64. woodstockwoody

    Bestiality and pedophilia are predatory. Being transgender isn't.

    December 27, 2012 at 3:18 pm | Report abuse |
  65. Rob

    Wow, most of you must feel really insecure to be so obsessed with gay's and transgender people's civil rights! Do you feel much better about your miserable lives after spewing hate?

    December 27, 2012 at 3:17 pm | Report abuse |
  66. Dick Izinya

    Spurious, "slippery slope" argument. Learn2Logic.

    December 27, 2012 at 3:17 pm | Report abuse |
  67. ncgh

    So we declassify these people as having a disorder, but we classify thousands of ill behaved kids as having attention deficit disorder.

    Do these people understand the meaning of the word disorder?

    December 27, 2012 at 3:16 pm | Report abuse |
    • jonathanweeston

      We are going to continually grow more and more mentally ill as a nation and planet as long as we continue to consume processed foods and genetically altered vegetables and animals.

      December 27, 2012 at 3:20 pm | Report abuse |
      • Kip Oliver

        No, JonathanWeeston...we continue to grow more mentally ill as a nation as we continue to find something else to take responsibilty for our actions. Hey, it's not my fault...I'm mentally ill.

        December 27, 2012 at 3:50 pm | Report abuse |
      • Merv

        So if I want to cut off 1 of my 10 fingers, I'm insane. But if I want to cut off my one and only wingwang, there's absolutely nothing wrong with me.

        Yeah, right.

        December 28, 2012 at 1:43 am | Report abuse |
    • factChik

      LOL !!! Children are not a powerful voting block. Gays and lesbians are; hence kids have disorders and gay people- well, we just smile.

      December 27, 2012 at 4:54 pm | Report abuse |
      • aash

        You've got it backwards, the reason ADD continues to exist and is actually being expanded upon in the DSM5 is because if its an illness its easier to market drugs towards. No reason to label anyone with gender dysphoria as a nutcase, as they're already willing to buy up hormone drugs, labelling it as a disease has no effect on that.

        December 27, 2012 at 5:27 pm | Report abuse |
  68. Johnny

    That's absurd you people are scared to death of anything that isn't exactly like or doesn't believe exactly like you. You are the ones with a "disorder".

    December 27, 2012 at 3:15 pm | Report abuse |
  69. Pork Chop

    These fruitcakes are still weird and literally oddballs to society. They should stay in the closet and keep quiet about their problems and not make everyone else have to deal with it.

    December 27, 2012 at 3:14 pm | Report abuse |
    • BlueDogMS

      And please tell me how you are dealing with it.

      December 27, 2012 at 3:16 pm | Report abuse |
    • Agree

      I totally agree with you.

      December 27, 2012 at 3:16 pm | Report abuse |
    • Shayb42

      Pork Chop,
      It's sad that you resort to name calling when you simply don't understand something. Prabably scary in your small mind. Ignorance is bliss...

      December 27, 2012 at 3:26 pm | Report abuse |
      • Pork Chop

        You shouldn't let things upset you so easily.

        December 27, 2012 at 3:32 pm | Report abuse |
  70. BlueDogMS

    Being gay is not illegal. Pedophilia most certainly is. Bestiality? I suppose that depends on where you live eh?

    December 27, 2012 at 3:14 pm | Report abuse |
  71. Dick Izinya

    I celebrate trans people for making all of you cry yourself to sleep, wondering why god would inflict them upon you.

    December 27, 2012 at 3:14 pm | Report abuse |
    • frank

      I'm pretty sure normal people aren't crying. They don't spend their time thinking about cutting pieces of their body off. Like mentally ill people.

      December 27, 2012 at 3:44 pm | Report abuse |
  72. Agree

    Exactly.

    December 27, 2012 at 3:12 pm | Report abuse |
    • Mommy

      So if I want to cut off 1 of my 10 fingers, I'm insane. But if I want to cut off my one and only wingwang, there's absolutely nothing wrong with me.

      Yeah, right! No political correctness involved in this decision!

      December 28, 2012 at 12:02 am | Report abuse |
  73. sgurdog

    Have any tattoos on your body Bill? Even if you do not, do you still believe that the only thing a human being actually owns in this world is his/her body? If you do then you should put your opinion back in your holster and let people live as they damn well please.

    December 27, 2012 at 3:11 pm | Report abuse |
    • Bill

      I am not sure what you are trying to say here, there is no connection between tatoos and transgender surgeries.

      December 27, 2012 at 3:55 pm | Report abuse |
  74. Qman

    a

    December 27, 2012 at 3:11 pm | Report abuse |
  75. SeeThruIt2

    I might think I'm Napoleon Bonaparte. But, a genetic test would easily prove otherwise.

    December 27, 2012 at 3:04 pm | Report abuse |
    • Agree

      Don't worry, they'll tell you that you were are Liberace. lol

      December 27, 2012 at 3:14 pm | Report abuse |
      • Pork Chop

        LOL

        December 27, 2012 at 3:28 pm | Report abuse |
  76. Agree

    It is easy for gays to infiltrate science and government sectors and change definitions of things. And when news like this comes out everyone think it's good news. Public in general will believe whatever it is said, but they forget that discoveries like these may have been twisted by gays involvements.

    December 27, 2012 at 3:04 pm | Report abuse |
    • BlueDogMS

      The vast majority of gays are just fine with their bodies.

      December 27, 2012 at 3:10 pm | Report abuse |
    • Jack

      Transgenders are not gay. Please don't comment when you don't know what you're talking about.

      December 27, 2012 at 3:11 pm | Report abuse |
      • frank

        But they're both mentally ill.

        December 27, 2012 at 4:16 pm | Report abuse |
    • Agree

      Both group supports each others, so whats the difference.

      December 27, 2012 at 3:13 pm | Report abuse |
    • Sane Person

      Trans and gay are completely different. I'm sorry if the big world is scary to you, but we have stopped trying to catch you up. You'll be left in history with all of the other bigots who were unable to understand things.

      December 27, 2012 at 4:38 pm | Report abuse |
  77. B

    The small difference here being that they are not hurting anyone else, how you can compare them to pedophiles is beyond me.

    December 27, 2012 at 3:01 pm | Report abuse |
  78. B

    You realize that many are born as transgenders right? So if you believe in God, you can blame him for mutilating their bodies.

    December 27, 2012 at 2:58 pm | Report abuse |
    • Logtaads2

      Didn't take long for someone to blame God.

      December 27, 2012 at 4:04 pm | Report abuse |
  79. woodstockwoody

    Bill missed the part where Hannah said, "Unless you are a trans person, you should not be attempting to lecture those of us who are." No kidding. I wouldn't go near a transgender debate unless I was a psychologist or transgender. Or both :) It's way too complex, and if you're not living it everyday or have a close friend or family member who is, you most likely don't know jack about it. I don't understand it myself. I prefer to just sit back and wish them happiness and optimism.

    December 27, 2012 at 2:57 pm | Report abuse |
    • Bill

      No, I did not miss it. It is just wrong. You cannot simply ask a person if they are "happy" after the surgery. Of course they will say yes after going through the ordeal. THey need to justify it to themselves and to others. That is why statistics, like the suicide rate. are more telling. If you ask the person themselves, you will get an emotional response. I speak of facts, which cannot be denied. Notice, no one has responded to this.

      December 27, 2012 at 3:09 pm | Report abuse |
      • someone

        Where did you get your facts? Are you a doctor? Have you asked someone firsthand? You can spout all you want about "facts" you believe to be true. Back them up with proof.

        December 27, 2012 at 4:33 pm | Report abuse |
    • Bill

      No, I did not miss it. It is just wrong. You cannot simply ask a person if they are "happy" after the surgery. Of course they will say yes after going through the ordeal. THey need to justify it to themselves and to others. That is why statistics, like the suicide rate. are more telling. If you ask the person themselves, you will get an emotional response. I speak of facts, which cannot be denied. Notice, no one has responded to this.

      December 27, 2012 at 3:10 pm | Report abuse |
      • Hannah

        Bill, you look to statistics for answers to a question that can't be answered with numbers. The suicide rate is as much a reflection on society as it is on the person in any and every case. Have you ever actually met somebody who's transgendered? Before and after? I have, I am one as has been established, and I can tell you that there's some things graphs and charts will never be able to tell you such as how much easier it becomes to appreciate life. A lot of the time when transgendered people kill themselves it's because even after surgery they don't feel like they've accomplished a successful transition, and whether it's due to societal pressure, or due to the inability to accept that you don't have to have been physically born a woman or a man to be one it's tragic that those people's lives become nothing more for people like you to attempt to use against us. There are realities we have to deal with, such as the inability a transwoman has to carry a child, or that a transman has to impregnate a woman, and even though those aren't exclusive to us and can drive an infertile or sterile CIS person to suicide as well, they are common reasons for why some transpeople have as much trouble accepting themselves as others do.

        Will I ever be a genetic woman? No, but I can be happy living as one because that's how I feel, and it's only "wrong" based on individual perception. When it comes right down to it however, I would argue that the only individual whose perception can really determine the right way for me to live is me, and in that matter nobody else' opinion means jack.

        December 27, 2012 at 3:43 pm | Report abuse |
      • Logtaads2

        Read your own posts because to me it screams psychological/mental disorder. The DSM change is a matter of social/political pressure not the result of compelling medical evidence. Hence I have absolutely no respect for the profession... It's a joke.

        December 27, 2012 at 4:13 pm | Report abuse |
      • jess

        wow! not only are you intuitive but you're also psychic! shut up and sit down, sir.

        December 27, 2012 at 4:13 pm | Report abuse |
      • someone

        Where did you get your facts? Are you a doctor? Have you asked someone firsthand? You can spout all you want about "facts" you believe to be true. Back them up with proof.

        December 27, 2012 at 4:32 pm | Report abuse |
  80. Camille Mseikeh

    Is it just like wearing a mustache? Some grow their beard other don't, likewise some are transgendered other stay-gendered?

    December 27, 2012 at 2:57 pm | Report abuse |
    • Jack

      Camille, don't you have holiday homework to finish up?

      December 27, 2012 at 3:12 pm | Report abuse |
  81. Larry

    They keep removing mental disorders from the list, and then wonder how crazies get their hands on guns.

    December 27, 2012 at 2:52 pm | Report abuse |
    • Dakota

      Yeah because we all know a transgender is going to go and shoot up a school. Some of you people are real ignorant.

      December 27, 2012 at 2:57 pm | Report abuse |
    • Edwin

      It isn't the cuts to the diagnosis list that cause problems - it is the cuts to public health and crisis management budgets that push people over the edge.

      December 27, 2012 at 3:03 pm | Report abuse |
    • Johnny

      Are you serious? You don't think crazies have had guns for years? Your comment is nonsense.

      December 27, 2012 at 3:16 pm | Report abuse |
    • texcal68

      Never took any critical thinking classes, right?

      December 27, 2012 at 3:51 pm | Report abuse |
    • Kip Oliver

      Crazies got his hand on guns that he stole from his SANE, MENTALLY FIT mother. Or did you forget? Yeah, you forgot.

      December 27, 2012 at 3:51 pm | Report abuse |
  82. Edwin

    It must be embarrassing to have such backward views. I am sorry for you.

    December 27, 2012 at 2:50 pm | Report abuse |
  83. K

    Thanks for being a voice for actual trangendered people. It's always good to hear points from all sides.

    But I have a problem with your arguement that it's a physical issue not a mental one. Your are saying it's all acids and bases, The problem with that argument is that it's not true. Your hormonal balance and acids and bases ARE in balance with your biology! It's in your head that it's not. There is no biological reason to feel like you are of a different gender. So than other than mental that argument is bunk.

    I also assume you want gender reassignment paid for by insurance?

    December 27, 2012 at 2:47 pm | Report abuse |
    • Hannah

      Well I guess in some respect it is all in my head, but not the way you're implying. The brain in my head is female, and my body was male, I'm working on changing the second because I can't change the first. If I could, I would, because it would mean I wouldn't have to go through this long and arduous process, but I can't (and believe me I've tried, a lot of us do and have before starting), so I'm doing what I have to to be happy just living life.
      If you need evidence to back up my claims, do a little research into the reactions that many CIS males get when they receive hormone therapy for prostate cancer etc. They typically become a lot more irritable, depressed, angry, unhappy, all of the things I was before I began HRT, and wasn't after/am not now. While most physicians do not want to compare the two or make any arguments based on common sense because those in the profession who try to disguise bigotry by asking for solid, irrefutable evidence will debate it, it makes sense if nothing else to look at the chemical reaction someone has after beginning hormones. This, to me, is why even though I see it as a physical disorder I still believe therapy is a good first step since if you do begin hormones, and they don't work, then they can help you look for another path, but if they do work then voila, you've found the problem.

      Of course I won't argue there are some people who force themselves or begin the transition because of a traumatic event, and it's unfortunate that there are such people since it makes those of us with legitimate cause for transitioning appear to have a weaker case, but those people are fewer in number than those of us in need and so should not be held against us. :/

      December 27, 2012 at 3:27 pm | Report abuse |
      • Hannah

        Also K, if I could pay for my own surgery I would because it would mean I could afford the long waiting list and zillion loopholes the government wants me to jump through for coverage, but being a person in my early twenties and below the poverty line, I can afford neither insurance, nor can I afford to drop 20k+ on surgery, so I'm looking to the government for it. I live in Canada, and the way I see it, why do people pay such high taxes if we aren't able to make use of the money when we really need it?
        I would so much rather pay my own way, but I'm not ashamed to ask for a little help, and give back in ways I can whether it's by volunteering for crisis hotlines, being as courteous as possible to everybody I meet, and when I can, financially.

        December 27, 2012 at 3:32 pm | Report abuse |
      • Hannah

        It would mean I could afford to skip the long waiting list* lol typos...

        December 27, 2012 at 3:33 pm | Report abuse |
  84. woodstockwoody

    Yes, GetReal. A legion of people with doctorates is wrong and somehow your opinion on a scientific matter is correct?

    December 27, 2012 at 2:42 pm | Report abuse |
  85. BlueDogMS

    As long as we don't start covering these reassignment surgeries at the expense of truly necessary procedures, I don't care what they call it.

    December 27, 2012 at 2:42 pm | Report abuse |
    • Edwin

      If someone's private insurance, which they pay for, covers such surgery, what possible business is it of yours?

      December 27, 2012 at 2:51 pm | Report abuse |
      • BlueDogMS

        It raises everyone's premiums. I suppose tax dollars going to pay for emergency room visits are none of the taxpayer's business either?

        December 27, 2012 at 2:58 pm | Report abuse |
      • everything in Moderation

        I suppose a transgendered client—who will likely never have a baby—shouldn't have to pay for childbirth coverage for the other clients, either. Makes sense. How about all those family coverage clients with their children piling onto the plan? Why should the transgendered insurance client have to pay higher premiums to pay for rug-rat care?

        December 27, 2012 at 3:10 pm | Report abuse |
      • BlueDogMS

        Comparing childbirth to what basically amounts to cosmetic surgery is hardly the same.

        December 27, 2012 at 3:12 pm | Report abuse |
      • Johnny

        Yes childbirth is hardly the same. We have way too much childbirth and way too many people on the planet. Transgenders aren't contributing to the over population crisis so they are better for the planet than more useless dependents.

        December 27, 2012 at 3:20 pm | Report abuse |
    • sgurdog

      Everything under health care should be covered by a health insurance plan. If someone buys a policy that includes this type of surgery then they are actually paying for it, not the taxpayer. I don't support a prisoner getting a free surgery that isn't life threatening but I surely support the right of anyone to participate in a healthcare program that actually provides the services they may want or need. It's the people without the plan that costs us as taxpayers, not those who have one.

      December 27, 2012 at 3:23 pm | Report abuse |
    • Sane Person

      Yea, we dont like paying for the crap you get that we dont consider necessary either.

      December 27, 2012 at 4:40 pm | Report abuse |
  86. Brad

    Step 1 should really be generally reducing the stigma about mental illness, not defensively declassifying what was once considered a mental illness because it is stigmatized.

    December 27, 2012 at 2:38 pm | Report abuse |
    • everything in Moderation

      Excellent point!

      December 27, 2012 at 3:10 pm | Report abuse |
  87. Bill

    Hannah: I will not argue that the murder rate/abuse of transgender does not exist. My point here is in cold hard statistics, which are most relevant. Your witness testimony is actually the worse kind of proof, it is based on subjective ideas rather than objective proof. You were born one gender, and were not destined to be another. Would you think I was right or wrong if I felt that I should be white as opposed to black, and was born with the wrong skin color? Now I need to go through those changes that I "know" will make me happier, at a huge expense. The reality is that this surgery, based on FACTS, will not make you happier. I think you need to accept who you are, you are not a woman if you are not born that way. I am not 7 feet tall if I am five feet. We cannot make ourselves into something we are not.

    December 27, 2012 at 2:38 pm | Report abuse |
    • sgurdog

      It's not as uncommon as you may think. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Two-Spirit

      December 27, 2012 at 3:16 pm | Report abuse |
    • everything in Moderation

      You have not shown yourself to have facts, Bill, only stat figures (not supplied) whose numbers, supposedly alone, back up your opinion. Your "proof" is no better than anecdotal in that anybody can find stats to back up any side of any argument. Stats need context and proper analytical reporting before being useful at all.

      December 27, 2012 at 3:37 pm | Report abuse |
  88. ChrisMN

    If being transgender is normal, then they should no longer covered by the Americans with Disabilities Act. And I agree with the post that stated that any surgery should be considered cosmetic unless it is medically necessary. That means no artificial breasts for John/Jane Doe, unless he/she wants to pay for them themselves...

    December 27, 2012 at 2:34 pm | Report abuse |
    • saganhill

      What are you, a Doctor? What credentials do you have? Your lack of those credentials shows where those asinine statements come from.

      December 27, 2012 at 2:48 pm | Report abuse |
    • everything in Moderation

      And no coverage for breeding. It is not medically necessary for people to have offspring.

      December 27, 2012 at 3:12 pm | Report abuse |
  89. Hannah

    Also, the suicide rate is in large part due to the amount of scrutiny we face when we "come out" as it were to the public and our families. The murder rate is also extremely high for us, and most of the time it's directly related to us being transgendered. Before you decide whether the problem is with us or society you might want to take a look at ALL of the statistics regarding our very small population.

    December 27, 2012 at 2:33 pm | Report abuse |
  90. Steve

    I dressed up as a woman once for Holloween, wouldn't want to go to work or church that way.

    December 27, 2012 at 2:28 pm | Report abuse |
  91. K

    Trying this again!!!

    I have to share a thought here. If we are saying that trans people are not mentally ill, then great. Then there is nothing "wrong" with them and that they are "normal". Assuming that their bodies function properly as their chromosomes dictate, than we treat them like everyone else. Non trans people do not need surgical intervention to be their "normal" selves so trans people should then be denied insurance paying for gender reassignment surgery. Unless there is something "wrong" with them, in this case a mental disorder. Just like "B" augmentation, gender reassignment surgery is then cosmetic to a perfectly healthy person. Usless we want to pay for "B" implants for women who want to feel like "more of a woman" or "P" implants for men for want to feel "like more of a man"!

    So great trans people. You are not mentally ill. But you better pay for your cosmetic insecurities.

    December 27, 2012 at 2:24 pm | Report abuse |
    • K

      thats correct! Apparently we can't use grown up words in appropriate context. It was reviewed and deleted!

      December 27, 2012 at 2:32 pm | Report abuse |
    • Hannah

      "a valid candidate for hormones, surgery*, etc" didn't mean to repeat therapy, my bad

      December 27, 2012 at 2:55 pm | Report abuse |
    • everything in Moderation

      You've made a lot of sense here. Expect brutal replies.

      December 27, 2012 at 3:16 pm | Report abuse |
    • K

      But I have a problem with your arguement that it's a physical issue not a mental one. Your are saying it's all acids and bases, The problem with that argument is that it's not true. Your hormonal balance and acids and bases ARE in balance with your biology! It's in your head that it's not. There is no biological reason to feel like you are of a different gender. So than other than mental that argument is bunk. Where is the science?

      December 27, 2012 at 3:20 pm | Report abuse |
    • castmd

      ". Of course, getting SRS is not something I consider purely cosmetic, since most of us feel we need it to be complete..
      ...it's still arguably a necessity for a "full" and successful transition."

      How is that any different then someone who is greatly embarrassed by going balled at the age of 19 and wanting insurance to cover hair implants? What about someone who has a mild deformity of the ear or a limb? What about someone who in order to "feel complete" wants to surgically alter their labia, or converts to Judaism later in life and wants their foreskin removed to "complete their transition"? In my opinion, you are welcome to be and do whatever you want as long as it doesn't affect everyone else, but I sure as hell am not going to pay for it when it is MEDICALLY unnecessary,

      December 27, 2012 at 3:31 pm | Report abuse |
    • Logtaads2

      What. a crock. The DSM isn't worth the paper it is written on.

      December 27, 2012 at 3:47 pm | Report abuse |
    • Hannah

      Castmd, it's different because the literal definition of being a male does not include having hair, and being a female does not necessarily mean having breasts, or at least it doesn't include a guideline for a necessary size. The literal definition of being female however does include having a V, and likewise being a man includes having a P. Of course there are those people who identify somewhere in the middle of the spectrum and are classified as gender Q, but the gender extremes, male and female, do require certain genitalia. A lot of people opt not to have surgery because this process is more about being happy in your own skin/life than anything else, but if they do then it is classifiable as a necessity if it's what they feel they need to be appreciated as male, female, or whatever. It's also a legal qualification in some places.. for example, here I can't get my id, passport, driver's license, or even bank information to classify me as being legally female unless I'm post-op. If the government is going to require me to get surgery before they'll consider me legally female, then they should D well pay for it.

      December 27, 2012 at 4:04 pm | Report abuse |
    • Hannah

      Also, regardless of the size of the end results, and the age you're beginning hormones at, female hormones will cause breast growth which is why I deem augmentation cosmetic. And once again, hair is not a requirement for being male or female.. lol

      December 27, 2012 at 4:08 pm | Report abuse |
    • tstring

      There is nothing psychologically wrong with them.

      Obviously there's an issue, but what the writers of the DSM have finally concluded (after being beaten with the science for years) is that the issue is not psychological, and the solution is therefore not going to be psychological.

      December 29, 2012 at 4:38 pm | Report abuse |
  92. Steve

    These minority groups lobby long enough, whine loud enough and scream equal rights until they change the laws just to get them off their backs. Get back in the closet, nobody cares. I have hang-ups too but I don't want the whole world knowing about them. If a guy has trouble being a guy, keep it to yourself for God sake. I sure wouldn't go around telling averybody. I can just hear my wife if I told her "I should be a woman". She'd tell me, "wear high heels for a week then get over it".

    December 27, 2012 at 2:19 pm | Report abuse |
    • everything in Moderation

      Your response shouts "I'm a man married to a woman!" which makes it a little strange as a post telling people to keep their state of being to themselves.

      Did anybody need to know you had a wife?
      Did anybody need to know she keeps you in your place as a man?
      Did anybody need to know you conform to expectations?

      Nope.

      December 27, 2012 at 3:24 pm | Report abuse |
    • Jonathan Davis

      In rewriting the diagnostic manual they should have classified 'SELF INFLICTED IGNORANCE' as a mental disorder. Then you could get the help you so obviously need.

      December 27, 2012 at 3:27 pm | Report abuse |
    • texcal68

      Steve, it must be great being prefect! Sure wish the rest us poor people could be like you.

      December 27, 2012 at 3:54 pm | Report abuse |
    • cnoi45

      Steve, I think that was the post of the day. Well said!

      December 27, 2012 at 11:42 pm | Report abuse |
  93. albert

    It will only be a matter of time before these same experts will declare that pedophiles are normal too. We live in an extremely sick world.

    December 27, 2012 at 2:17 pm | Report abuse |
    • Agree

      Totally agree with that.

      December 27, 2012 at 2:52 pm | Report abuse |
    • sgurdog

      And another thing... pedophilia involves at least one adult and one child, has nothing to do with transgender people who as far as I know do not commit a CRIME. Learn the difference.

      December 27, 2012 at 3:04 pm | Report abuse |
    • Shayb42

      Albert,
      Your comment shows your ignorance...

      December 27, 2012 at 3:31 pm | Report abuse |
  94. realistic

    Have you gone through this surgery? Are you a physician that works on cases like these? Or is all this simply personal opinion of which it doesn't mean a hill of beans?

    December 27, 2012 at 2:14 pm | Report abuse |
    • Bill

      You need to dig a bit to find the information since it is not considered politically correct to question whether this is healthy or not. The statistics, if you look, are on credible sources and do state that the rate actually goes up, not down. You may look it up if you do not believe me, but it will take time to sort through the garbage and get to the credible sites.

      December 27, 2012 at 2:19 pm | Report abuse |
    • xtra

      Bill, there are "normal" people out there who commit suicide all the time. That's not normal to me. People who use body piercings and tattoos are mutilating their bodies just as people do with plastic surgery. By your definition, 90% of the world is abnormal.

      December 27, 2012 at 2:23 pm | Report abuse |
    • Rob

      To some, it matters quite a bit, I'm sure. Of all the things you can do, this seems the one thing in life that there's 'no going back'. You better be sure it's what you want, and advocates have to be VERY careful not to try and 'recruit' people who are not good fits for this surgery. That being said, it's a good thing to remove it from the DSM, legitimate cases are not disorders or diseases in the common sense of the terms.

      December 27, 2012 at 3:03 pm | Report abuse |
  95. confused

    "That old diagnosis meant that a man who believed he was destined to be a woman was considered mentally ill."........what about a woman who believes she was destined to be a man?????

    December 27, 2012 at 2:14 pm | Report abuse |
    • xtra

      That's legitimate. Women are allowed to wear men's clothing but men are not allowed to wear women's clothing.

      December 27, 2012 at 2:19 pm | Report abuse |
      • woodstockwoody

        Because it's not considered shameful to want to be like a man but it is considered shameful to want to be like a woman.

        December 27, 2012 at 3:00 pm | Report abuse |
    • everything in Moderation

      Because male is the species and female is the "other" of the species.

      December 27, 2012 at 3:26 pm | Report abuse |
    • Tatiana Covington

      This physical phenomenon of FtM transgender is also fairly common. Matter and energy, physics and chemistry: that's all this is because that's all that actually exists.

      December 28, 2012 at 4:01 pm | Report abuse |
  96. JeffinIL

    No comments allowed.

    December 27, 2012 at 2:08 pm | Report abuse |
  97. Whome

    I agree it's more like a perversion.

    December 27, 2012 at 2:08 pm | Report abuse |
    • xtra

      Now we can call you perverted?

      December 27, 2012 at 2:19 pm | Report abuse |
  98. JeffinIL

    Wonderful. Being transgender is no longer a mental disorder but autism now is.

    December 27, 2012 at 1:52 pm | Report abuse |
    • realistic

      Give an example of how it is?

      December 27, 2012 at 2:15 pm | Report abuse |
    • Edwin

      Autism always has been. They changed autism to include Aspberger's, not to make autism a disorder.

      December 27, 2012 at 2:54 pm | Report abuse |
  99. blake

    The APA needs to close up shop and call it quits. Absolutely no credibility. A gay life is a normal and healthy lifestyle. Being transgender is also normal. Guns kill people, not mentally deranged people. And people with a good sense of morality are racists and deviants. Sad!

    December 27, 2012 at 1:49 pm | Report abuse |
    • woodstockwoody

      Your opinion is sad.

      December 27, 2012 at 2:58 pm | Report abuse |
      • Edwin

        i agree with you. Anyone who worries about the orientation of other people has issues.

        December 27, 2012 at 6:44 pm | Report abuse |
    • Agree

      Define to me what is healthy.

      December 27, 2012 at 3:06 pm | Report abuse |
  100. Quit Crying

    A rose by any other name is still a rose.

    December 27, 2012 at 1:47 pm | Report abuse |
    • sumday

      and a rose by any other name is still a flower not a tree, animal, or car.

      December 27, 2012 at 1:53 pm | Report abuse |
      • realistic

        Unless it's in the government.

        December 27, 2012 at 2:16 pm | Report abuse |
      • Edwin

        But we are not talking about what to call transgendered people. We are talking about whether they are mentally ill or just mentally different. My personal opinion is that it doesn't really matter to me, so I will leave it to the people who deal with mental illness on a daily basis to figure out what is the best notation for different things.

        What you call them is your business. I would hope you would use polite terms when in their company, but if you want to make fun of them when they're not around, that's up to you. I agree with you, however, that English is poorly equipped to deal with people whose gender is not standard. It is a conundrum, albeit a fairly minor one.

        December 27, 2012 at 6:52 pm | Report abuse |
      • Quit Crying

        Edwin, The point I was making is you can call them sane or normal in the DSM-5 if you want, but they are still nuts.

        December 29, 2012 at 5:57 pm | Report abuse |
1 2