As California mandate looms, some LGBT curriculum already in place
By Debra Goldschmidt, CNN In America
(CNN) - In 10th grade English at Los Angeles’ Grover Cleveland High School, Danielle Taklender's students read the book "Luna" by Julie Anne Peters. It's a story about a transgender teen.
Taklender has been teaching the book for seven years without any fanfare or push back. It’s getting noticed now as her school district takes the lead in developing a plan to comply with the first state law mandating lesbian, gay, bisexual, and transgender history and social science curricula. The California law, which takes effect in January, stops short of dictating how schools are to comply and leaves that up to the districts and schools themselves to figure out.
Taklender uses "Luna" to expose students to new vocabulary and different ways of thinking about pronouns. The students discuss gender identity versus sexual orientation, as well as gender roles in literature. Taklender said she teaches this book the same way she teaches every other book.
She says the only negative feedback she has run into was a parent who once requested an alternate assignment after the class finished reading the book.
“No students ever say they changed their sexual orientation because of it,” Taklender said.
The new law, called the California Fair Education Act, also requires schools teach about the contributions of Native Americans, and people with disabilities. It also bans instructional materials that adversely reflect on a person due to their sexual orientation. The requirements are actually an expansion to the education code already in existence, which requires lesson plans to include various ethnic groups.
But it is not without controversy. Some opponents have religious objections, others say it’s part of sex education and belongs at home not in schools. Others simply don’t want this taught to their children.
So far, opposition efforts to repeal the law, which passed last summer, have failed. There are currently at least five initiative measures awaiting review by the attorney general that could make their way on the ballot for next year's election, but it’s too late to stop the law that takes effect next month. If any of the ballot measures pass, they will undo the curriculum that is already in place.
Although individual teachers, like Taklender, have innovated LGBT studies, there aren’t any system-wide models for districts to duplicate, said Jill Marcellus, a spokeswoman for the Gay-Straight Alliance Network.
The Gay, Lesbian & Straight Education Network’s 2009 National School Climate Survey found that about 13% of students were taught in a positive way about lesbian, gay, bisexual or transgender people in any of their classes.
Scott Hirschfeld, director of curriculum at the Anti-Defamation League, said kids can go from kindergarten through 12th grade without ever learning about an LGBT person.
“They are really getting an incomplete history,” he said. “The reality is that in most schools this is not a standard part of curriculum.”
In California, many schools have taken a wait-and-see approach, but not the Los Angeles Unified School District. In September, they set a 60-day deadline to develop a new curriculum. This was added to a resolution for affirmation of the district's anti-bullying measures to protect lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender people.
The change isn’t much different than in 2004, when the districts had to update health materials to address gender and sexuality, said Judy Chiasson, program coordinator for Los Angeles Unified School District’s Office of Human Relations, Diversity and Equity. At the time, the district had to create its own material, she said, because there wasn't anything similar out there.
The district has reviewed what is already working in some of its classrooms. Educators have also looked at materials by groups including the Anti-Defamation League, the Southern Poverty Law Center, University of California Los Angeles and University of Southern California. Those materials are the basis of a draft implementation plan for Los Angeles schools that is currently under review by the district Superintendent, a spokeswoman said.
In the meantime, at Downtown Magnets High School in Los Angeles, Daniel Jocz's eleventh grade history students continue to discuss lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender issues. The subject has been part of Jocz's lesson plans since he started teaching seven years ago. Some days, that means a discussion about language: the negative use of the word 'gay' or using 'guys' to describe women. His students will often compare and contrast the use of these words with racial slurs.
The students have also looked at case studies that compare the 1955 murder of 14-year-old African-American Emmett Till in Mississippi with the 1998 murder of gay Wyoming college student, Matthew Shepard.
"There are parallels between the gay situation and the civil rights movement,” Jocz said. "If you don't include it as part of the narrative, you are ignoring it. You have to acknowledge it.”
Every generation has altered the way history is taught in schools, New York University history and education Professor Jonathan Zimmerman said. In the 1920s, it was the Irish, in the 1950s and 1960s, it was African-Americans and in the 1970s, it was Latinos.
“There was a time when history books only had white guys,” Zimmerman said. “Over time, successive groups fought to have their story become part of the main story.”
Adding lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender studies is no different, he said. But schools must be careful not to just celebrate the group - they need to address tough questions and do some hard thinking. For example, he said, sending soldiers to fight for freedom for others while denying gay freedom in the military.
“We need to think about why we’re including them and what the purpose of these stories is in the first place,” Zimmerman said.
Which is why schools are looking at Taklender’s English class and Jocz’s history class. They are still trying to learn how this generation’s history will be taught.
Taklender and Jocz say they are just doing their jobs.
"Even though I knew it was revolutionary,” Taklender said, “I didn't think it was a big deal."
About In America
What defines you? Maybe it’s the shade of your skin, the place you grew up, the accent in your words, the make up of your family, the gender you were born with, the intimate relationships you chose to have or your generation? As the American identity changes we will be there to report it. In America is a venue for creative and timely sharing of news that explores who we are. Reach us at inamerica@cnn.com.
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I don't understand why it's necessary to point out who was and who wasn't gay in the context of American history. Isn't this like that Simpsons episode where they scroll a list of names on t.v. of people who are gay? What exactly is this supposed to accomplish? Are we just trying to communicate that gays are normal people capable of achieving great things? Why can't we focus more on the recent civil rights wins for gays instead of parading a bunch of stories about historically important gays in front of kids?
California voters understand why it is WRONG to try to hide LGBT Americans. Come to California, and just about anyone can explain it to you. Sorry you live in such a backwards place.
I live in California and I have several close friends who are gay. I'm going to talk to them about this and see what they they, but I have a feeling they're going to laugh at it. There's no reason to treat gays like kids in the Special Olympics and give them posthumous medals of honor for being gay. Teach what is important in American history instead of going out of your way to further divide the country into pockets of people with particular agendas and values distinct from American values.
Yeah, you live in such a "forward" place. California on the edge of collapse and you're telling us what's good for us? I'll take my backward ways any day.
I suppose one could say the same about black history or Christians.
Holy crap.. talk about backwards... Putting an emphasis on "LGBT" as if they are "special" and require special inclusion is just wrong.
I guess people are too stupid to see that this is what causes the problem in the first place.
Exactly.
That is why I live in Montana, to avoid this @#$#!!
Wow. Have fun up there living in ignorance.
Unfortunately, a lot of other people have to live here in Montana WITH the ignoramuses.
Of course, we didn't have time to make any laws like this here. Our lawmakers were busy trying to pass laws to legalize spearhunting, make global warming seen as "a good thing", and allow our kids to carry guns in school.
We have the wrong people developing the curriculum, the focus should be on better and more effective education, developing fundamentals. Teachers should use what they're most effective at teaching, the lessons about diversity are something that colleges can teach.
Wow. You are a bigot.
Yes, because K through 12 is the best time to brainwash kids.
So you just can't wait for a more tolerant America. Thats the pressing need of the moment. You know, there are some pretty intolerant countries in this world that are building nuclear bombs, inventing cutting edge technologies and are far ahead of American children in terms of education. And you are worried about intolerance? Get a real education you shmuck and quit defending disgusting behavior
I find intolerance disgusting.
If you find intolerance disgusting, aren't you being intolerant of intolerance? So, you disgust yourself?
Heteros can engage in disgusting behavior in the privacy of their own bedrooms, too. Get an education.
You mean like the same countries we have being fighting with for decades.,like the red army in Saigon (Communist China) or the Soviet space crafts and nuclear arms.(Russia)
yep! And how has gay history helped us conquer tyranny?
The Nazis were defeated in large part because the allies cracked their encryption (Enigma code). That was almost 100% due to the genius of one man, Gay mathematician Alan Turing. He was persecuted for being gay and despite having played a huge part in winning the war ended up disgraced and committed suicide. Even Churchill recognized that Alan Turing was a huge part of victory in europe.
Now you would know this if Alan Turing's work was highlighted in history, as this CA law suggests.
You basically proved why this law matters and is needed
Are you suggesting we should strive to be more like the countries you reference?
Our enemies are laughing at us. America is focusing on trying to make devients feel better about themselves and terrorist nations are excelling in math and science. Even friendly countries are out doing America in business. America needs to make math, science and writing the most important topics in education, not abnormal insidious behavior.
So let's ask a fundamental question. Why must Christ return?
That guy died a long time ago... you are delusional if you actually believe people can rise from the dead... lol
Then I guess all people who have been revived are still dead. If you had a relative who has been revived, I guess they are still dead then.
If you read anything outside of the Bible The real question is "did he ever exist."
Without him, you wouldn't exist, so obviously, he did.
False, not Truth,
Because he will bring the world to peace, and prove you're beliefs wrong. He might not come in our lifetime, but he will prove you wrong when you burn in hell.
The statement I made, in regards to Christ's return, can only be discussed properly between those who actually have a belief. If you reply in such a way, that shows you do not have a belief in Christ then you consider me blind, as do I you, so our words are then babbling, as is this whole forum is chalking up to be. I ask the question again.........who then, can solve this?
I agree, I mean why are they even teaching about reading and pronouns and crap anyways! I say we just teach math and creationism.... ooh, wait......
Idiot. Back to your video games.
lol.. back to cleaning your guns and reading your bible.. Its not that hard to give out insults..
Name calling is the refuge of those without an argument.
There is a legal separation of Church and State, but none between Gay and Straight!
I'm a lesbian but I find the US government and media's obsession with LGBT issues extremely strange. Most gay people are desperate for positive attention and aren't realizing that there is something weird going on. Hillary Clinton makes a speech about gay rights and human rights and how the Obama administration is doing everything to help gays and lesbians... all the while starting and continuing illegal wars that have killed millions of innocent people. They don't care about human rights. They don't even care about americans who have lost their homes and are living in tent cities. They don't care about the US economy, they keep lying and covering up things, but everytime I go on the CNN or abcnews website there's a pro-gay story. I'm not buying it.
Very good analysis Jenny.....very good.
Truth
Very good analysis Jenny.....very good.
________________________________
A good analysis because she is smart, not because she is gay.
It's all about getting your vote by trying to convince you they really care about you and the difficulties you've had in your life. It's an exploitation of members of your community. Politicians care foremost about their own careers and not you, me or even the ideology with which they are aligned. What we really need are leaders that are smart, hard working and insightful enough to recognize that their own ambitions and legacy are not more important than the health of the country. The problem is that those sorts of people are too smart, hardworking and insightful to become politicians.
It's because it's a political win on the left. The right does the same thing. It's all to make the party look better to certain groups of voters.
Good point.
I disagree. I think the Democratic Party is made up of people who genuinely care. War is disgusting, and I hate that it is happening. But I think our leaders are having to make a calculated decision on how volatile the situation is, when it would be safest for the innocent people in those countries, etc. I think the Democrats are trying to do their best with the hand that was dealt them, and I look forward to the day when there is no more war as well.
HAHAHAHAHA well...they have done a good job selling you on their nonsense. Yeah...they really care. Democrats have started and fought just as many wars as the Republicans throughout the course of history. Obama and the Democrats will not put an end to war. Nor will any politician or party.
What wars have the US started that have 'killed millions of people'? What are talking about? Every, innovation in this world comes from the United States and no, I am not an American.
This State can't fall off into the ocean soon enough.
I couldnt agree more!!! this is exactly why I have my son in a private school!
As do I.
And make the students and parents do their half of the education process- send the kids to school not hungry, and with their assignments done!
Does this make sense?
Not really, and I'm pretty liberal.
The majority of young people don't have problems with gays.
I don't think trying to win over the anti-gay crowd with classes is going to work because they've already made their value judgements, so this will probably only upset them further.
What did the designers of this policy expect? "OH! Now that I've learned about the hardship gays have endured I realize the error of my prejudiced ways! (Somehow I just don't see that happening).
It's about time there were some recognition. If it weren't for Alan Turing the Nazis might well have won WWII. (He also gave us the computer.) An oblivious nation then persecuted him for being gay which culminated in his suicide. Perhaps a bit of education is overdue.
Isn't it amazing how the conservative Brits repaid the gay man who single-handed gave them victory over a determined enemy? These idiots sitting spewing junk from their keyboards have never heard the name Alan Turing. There is good reason to believe that Isaac Newton was gay. Several great mathematicians and scientists were gay.
Ironically we are having this discussion on computers - a technology most credit to Turing.
He even realized his perversion and "offed" himself. Too bad more don't follow suit.
before or after he helped win wwII? wouldn't it be hysterical if he did it before? and europe lost? what a gas.. no pun intended.
This becomes a mandate, but our kids can't pray in school???
It's called govt schools. It will only get worse until we throw federal and state govts out of the education business.
If you want YOUR kid to pray in school, THEN put YOUR kid in a private school where they pray.
Excellent comment MaryM!!!!!!!!!!!
Right.. and if you want YOUR kid learning about LGBT send them to California!.. LOL
I don't believe that this should be discussed, but praying? Why should kids pray?
There are way to many religion. besides Don't all you guys call your Religions your moral compasses,which compass shall the schools hand off to your child
Yes, your kids can pray in school. They just can't be lead by a teacher, so that everyone in the class that doesn't share their religious views doesn't have to. Moreover, that has literally nothing to do with this article. You put two completely irrelevant statements next to each other and expected to incite cheers.
If your kids can't find enough time to pray outside of school, then you have miserably failed to indoctrinate them.
Your child can pray in school, no one can stop them from saying a prayer to themselves, they just ask that they don't infringe on the rights of other students who don't pray or have a different type of religion. Being agnostic, I would be greatly offended if my child was forced to pray, just like you would be offended if I approached your child about being agnostic. Being gay isn't a religion or a choice, just like having a different skin color isn't – there's no reason it can't be touched on in school.
your logic to begin seems acceptable. After that, skin color is not the same as a behavior. To go there and make the assumption that everyone sees this issue as a "civil rights" issue is disingenuous at best – and a slam at its worst.
It is a choice being a color is a whole different story.
Don't be naive. Children can pray or express themselves religiously at school. They can pray at their desks, say grace at lunch, or pray for success in athletics. It is the school that cannot recognize any specific religion and by law cannot endorse or be implied to endorse any religion whatsoever.
Rick Perry...is that you?
Exactly. I wish we can just disown CA as a state..It has to be the worst state in this country..They want you to learn about stupid gays, but you pray LIKE WE USED TO in school..Hope it falls in the Ocean very soon...It would be a blessing to all of us..
Children should be taught the history of any and all people that have effected the world. If that person happens to be gay, so what, if that person happened to be black, so what., it that person is caucasion, so what. History is history. That is common sense. The problem I have is when you try to force a group of people into the studies.
ALSO, having people pray in school is not the same thing. That is forcing people to participate in a religious act.
The far right GOPr's need to understand the difference. If you are spiritual, then practice your spirituality, but don't force your ceremonies upon others.
Blame the founding fathers for the whole separation of church and state nonsense.
Actually, children can pray in school. Children can even pray in large, organized groups at school. Teachers can serve as advisors for Christian student groups sponsored by the school (like the Fellowship of Christian Athletes). The teachers cannot lead the prayers nor can they actively participate in the group in public schools because they are agents of the government and the government is to have separation. But the kids are not legally banned from being actively Christian, Muslim, or any other faith in school.
Your kids can pray in school. I come from a New York City public school and I pray in class whenever I want to, and guess to who? The Christian God.
So, you actually believed Rick Perry's campaign advertisement?
Just because we're not forced to pray, it does not mean that we are not allowed to do so. Unless, what you really want is for the schools to mandate prayer.
Is there anything else the loonie left can think up to destroy the nation??? They have already done it to california and think they have done something great. There must not be an intellect among the voting population??? Oh yea that population is the one taking the hand outs and those taking others money to give the handouts!
It has nothing to do with "destroying" the nation. It has to do 1) with a political group pushing its agenda down everyone else's throats, and 2) isn't justified.
Why isn't it justified? Because, like below, anyone who was historically significant (e.g., an inventor or composer) was historically significant despite their being gay, despite their being male, despite their being white, despite their being any number of things.
Why? Because there is usually no causal effect between being "gay" and being good at math or science. Just like there's no connection between Wagner being an anti-semite and a great composer.
Riiiight...Martin Luther King's being famous had nothing to do with him being black.
Idiot.
I'm sorry that you misunderstood what was said. The question wasn't about what made MLK famous, it was about the causal connection between his skin color and his brilliance. Namely, there is none.
Unless, of course, you want to say any irrelevant quality is vindicated (being white, tall, having hair, being a racist, and so on) simply because a white person, a racist, etc. did something otherwise good in history.
If only Ted Turner knew in advance what a LIBERAL WRAG that CNN has become maybe he would have passed on starting it. I try not to read it but it is so ridiculous that I can't help but get my daily laugh
Never used to hate LGBT. I've always been live and let live. Over the years, they've changed my mind with they're self-absorbed crap.
So you hate all LGBTs now because you perceive some to be self-absorbed? Really?
I was never a racist or bigot, I was always of the mind live and let live. Until they came and started eating at the restaurants I was at, drinking at the fountains I drank from, and started wanting to mix with the "pure breeds".......
Ditto.
No one needs your self-apologetic approval. Congrats on lumping together millions of people actions into one amorphous term.
Ooh, touch, touchy.
Obviously, approval is exactly what they are seeking.
So it comes down to more PC social engineering in schools. this is what is wrong with our eduacation system. What is geared for? To keep teachers employed and serve social agenda's or educate students to enable them to get jobs to compete on a global scale. I am pretty sure germany, france, india, china, etc all currently cleaning our clock are more worried about legislating more science and engineering than non sesnsical, politically correct waste of time. Sad state of California is only compounded by this.
Ok –That's the problem! Now do something about it!
So teaching factual events about historical figures is what's wrong with education. You'd prefer fiction?
whit: "So teaching factual events about historical figures is what's wrong with education. You'd prefer fiction?"
Nah. It has 1) to do with a political group pushing its agenda onto everyone else (remember your opposition to creationism?), and 2) with the fact that someone's orientation has no causal connection to their accomplishments as a human.
Trying to draw a connection between the two means you'll also have to draw a connection between the racism, anti-semitism, etc. of all great men throughout history.
Are you willing to vindicate racism in that way?
Don't recall mentioning creationism. And yes, there are good reasons to look at the defining characteristics of historical figures. The history of colonists fleeing England in the Mayflower loses meaning without an understanding of religious intolerance toward the Puritans. The civil rights movement cannot be adequately understood without reference to the substance of the ideology and racial beliefs of those espousing racial segregation and oppression. The same is true of the Holocaust. The story of Alan Turing, the gay man who broke the Nazi enigma code and in the process invented the computer, is incomplete without the counterposition of the Nazi slaughter of gays in the Holocaust. No less important is the bitter irony of Turing's subsequent persecution and resultant suicide. Another example from the Nazi persecution of Jews which led many of Germany's finest minds to flee to allied countries where their contributions were critical to the advancement of any number of important scientific and cultural fields. So yes, the personal characteristics of individuals and the views of societies' toward those often has a profound historical effect.
It's about time. People need to stop ignoring/hating/wanting to change the fact that some people are gay. We have made,make, and will continue to make great contributions to society; Why should we condinue to be ignored, reviled, or left out of the pages of a book?
Because whether or not someone is gay, white, male, black, an anti-semite or a racist usually has no bearing on their accomplishments as an inventor, a scientist, a composer, and so on. Why? Because they didn't invent, compose, etc. "because" they were gay, it was because they were brilliant.
Unless, of course, you're going to advocate for a law requiring teachers to mention every time a white person or a racist invented something profound. I mean, after all, shouldn't we recognize them too?
Read the bio of Alan Turing.
Brilliant!
whit: "Read the bio of Alan Turing."
I'm sorry logic and causal connections are foreign to you.
Right on !
guess u didn't read it. Yes, there are good reasons to look at the defining characteristics of historical figures. The history of colonists fleeing England in the Mayflower loses meaning without an understanding of religious intolerance toward the Puritans. The civil rights movement cannot be adequately understood without reference to the substance of the ideology and racial beliefs of those espousing racial segregation and oppression. The same is true of the Holocaust. The story of Alan Turing, the gay man who broke the Nazi enigma code and in the process invented the computer, is incomplete without the counterposition of the Nazi slaughter of gays in the Holocaust. No less important is the bitter irony of Turing's subsequent persecution and resultant suicide. Another example from the Nazi persecution of Jews which led many of Germany's finest minds to flee to allied countries where their contributions were critical to the advancement of any number of important scientific and cultural fields. So yes, the personal characteristics of individuals and the views of societies' toward those often has a profound historical effect.
Why does it matter if person is gay when making their mark on history? That's the issue, the whole "I'm gay look at me thing". Why not just live life, who cares your preferences?
Last night I was in the ER w my partner of 17 years. She was in a car accident. We are 12 years apart in age. Staff kept wanting to refer to me as her mother. It's only bc there is no context for two women who love and care for each other in a lifetime committed relationship. Kids learn a lot from what is NOT taught as well as what is.
to aFish:
and how did them not recognizing your status change outcome for your partner?
This is ridiculous!!! I don't want anyone teaching my children that being gay is ok!!!
Yes, keep them ignorant about reality.
The reality is that there is absolutely no purpose to any of this "mandate" other than to continue to shove reprobate behaviors down the throats of children who don't know any better. It's indoctrinating them to accept things that are simply pointless in society. Were my child subject to this "lesson plan", I would allow them to fail that portion of the class.
The only reason it's not considered a mental illness any longer is because a group of gay doctors got together and had it removed from the DSM in 1973. Stop kidding yourself!
they are going to be exposed to all types of ppl in the future...it's only a matter of time before they are exposed to them...your efforts to shield them away from reality are futile.
First California takes away happy meals in toys, and now this? Wow, just wow. But hey, California can do whatever they want if Californians agree with it. That's why I choose to live in Texas. Try to push this nationally and we are going to have a problem.
You shall be gay. Resistance is futile. Now hold still.
Keep your habits to yourself.
I am being sarcastic. This is going way too far.
Only if you do the same.
No one is telling any straight people they must be gay. Wish we could say the same about trying to force gay people to be straight.
?
North Korea would be proud of this brain washing session.
Most people are moral and decent and treat each other well, but you need programs like this to counter-balance the cultural influence of hate-filled religious people.
It's not hate, it's the difference between right and wrong.
Grow up.
You are obligated to love your enemy, not to usurp the office of judgement.
So, it's okay to call religious people hate-filled. Got it.
Those hateful religious people who donate food, shelter, money, bibles, happiness, and educations to people who can't have them? What love have you ever done in your life if you think religion is hate filled?
What about mandating that the state stop spending more than its taking in, THEN mandate LBGT issue be taught?
How about we mandate that kids go to school for education only. Math, English, science, finance, art. Then go home and learn everything else.
You left history off your list. Or are you seeing History should only be taught at home?
History is never accurate...it is written by the winners
The state of California delivers more in taxes than it takes in from the federal government. You must be thinking about the south where federal intakes are much larger than contributions. Just because the South lives on federal welfare and DoD welfare for defense, doesn't mean the rest of the country does.
What specific contributions to history were specifically because they were gay??????
The history of women's fashion?
Oh, but what about all those, white, straight, left-handed men, with purple hair and green eyes...weren't they just the greatest!!!
I'm so glad I moved away from California
We are glad you moved out of our state, too. Hope your hatred and bigotry is better tolerated wherever you are now. Besides, you don't need our sunny weather because you'll have your entire afterlife to enjoy the heat 😉
This dividing up of America by ethnicity, gender, economics is WRONG. If someone did something noteworthy for or in the country mention it in proper context but they did not do it because they were some minority. This makes me sick!
Ditto
I just spoke with a burning shrubbery; it said "gays are ok, chill out." I should probably write this down, need to find my chisel.
Mockery will get you no where.
This is no mockery, woman, and I shall not suffer you to usurp my authority as man. By the will of God I command you to shut your mouth or suffer the holy wrath. Who are you to question the message that has been delivered to me by the Almighty? You are no one, for we are nothing except His servants, and you will do as he commands.
It got a laugh out of me!
lol ... it's funny how the same people that would say "being gay is wrong, because the bible says it's wrong" are the same people that would be stoned to death because they opened their mouth on this matter if we still lived by the bible. Btw, when's the last time you ran through the wood screaming "unclean" on your last period Isabel?
Stuffing your pride and prejudice into the mouth of God are we?
Why all the hate?
Its time for us to recognize all people. I propose we take it just a little further. How about recognising pedophiles and those folks who occasionally mix in a little horse, sheep or goat action ? They are accomplished people too.
Thank you.
The innovations, efforts, inventions, and genius of all people throughout history generally occurred "despite" their being white, their being gay, their being tall, black, an anti-semite, and so on.
Are we going to have to talk about the historical impact racists have had, simply because they did good things otherwise? Why not have a full course on Wagner's anti-semitism? Why not say that the Germans in the 30's hated Jews, but look at all the things they invented!
If this were any other group they would be excoriated for pushing an agenda down the throats of every kid in California.
I have been thinking along those lines too. since this madness about gay rights is about fighting the rights of all why "discriminate" against paedophiles. Why have people like the Penn State coach locked up for his indecent act with the boys he coached?
Honestly! Sanity needs to return to America and the west before it is too late! And it starts with having the right person back in the White house at the next elections. Someone who will be bold to undo all the damage that has been done in the last 4 years starting with repealing the don't ask don't tell law in the military. How can America depart from the principles of our founding fathers and expect things to remain the same?
Uh... we are talking about the rights of two consenting adults versus the rights of men who rape kids? No movement will defend that. Ever. Never ever ever. If the best defense you can come up with doesn't even address the issue but an unrelated one instead, then you have nothing. You have no point.
I wonder what the world would be like if the whole world was gay?
That would be pretty weird.
Then they would have classes about Straight people.. what a concept...
You can't adequately teach history by selectively leaving out parts because of someone's orientation. It's not history then....
Wrong! You cannot adequately teach history by leaving out, or changing factual information. You will not adequately teach history by emphasizing any one aspect of that history more so than other aspects. You want to know more about a person – show the kids a picture – they will know if he's black, hispanic, asian, anglo – probably won't know and or need to know what their favorite passtimes were ..
John Wayne...greatest actor ever! See, I taught you something without mentioning orientation. Go figure.
The Mandate is a UN population control program. It seems someone decided without a vote or scientific proof that there are to many people in the world. so this on of the modalities they use in attempt to keep people from reproducing.
You nailed it!!! Not many people can see the light on this. Looks like there are not very many people who have common sense these days.
I bet Mexicans in CA are having a good laugh right now, and rubbing their hands at the same time 🙂
Both of you are stupid! The world will see a massive die off just like "Thomas Malthus" Predicted.
No reason to wonder why folks are leaving the public schools by the millions. This is a sick and clear abuse of government authority ! This will come back and bite the far left in the rear.
Which is why my children attend a private school. It's focus is on the basics. I am more than willing to sacrifice to make sure they have the tools needed to be successful in life. If someone was gay or straight has no importance in the big picture of life.
God is right, the world is wrong
Let God be true and every man a liar.
Those that hear God the clearest aren't to be trusted with other people's money.
How far we have fallen. Our kids can't keep up in math, science and reading but now this is mandated. Really? How about the basics first. Also, is California bankrupt and now they are financing this? Wake up people!
The basics of math, science etc are also mandated. It's not as if people are sitting around going "eh, don't worry about that mathematics stuff, just teach them about GLBT agenda materials..."
The loonie left is destroying california and our inclusive nature and I really don't understand their elite nonsense.
What a senseless waste of money. Fortunaltly, they will also have to point out the acomplishments of straight people as well to fill the time as this class will be short.
How about implementing a law “let’s make sure our kids really excel in Math, Science, Physics, Business, Economics, English, Writing, etc.” I am not a religious person. I have nothing against gays, lesbians, etc. But do we really need to implement a law like this? This is one of the reasons our kids are failing in academics. I understand we need to teach tolerance. There has to be better ways than this.
Barry McGuire: "And you don't believe we're on the eve of destruction?"
Any opposition to this is an example of why its important to include GLBT Studies. Oh by the way Matthew Shepard died in the 1990's not the 80's. There are a lot of important people in history that were GLBT, ignoring those contributions is wrong.
Why can't their accomplishments stand on their own? Why must I also know they were Gay?
Exactly.
Mentioning them because they were "LGBT" is just as wrong as excluding them for the same reason.
I agree. If they are gay, it should be part of the story, but not the reason for their inclusion in the curriculum. It's impossible to tell the story of the gay rights movement without mentioning that many of the participants were gay. Leaving out the fact that Harvey Milk was gay would be ridiculous, as would leaving out the fact that Martin Luther King was black.
Okay, now how about other groups? It will never end.
That's a nice rhetorical tactic: "Anyone who disagrees with me is evidence that I am right." I'll have to remember that one.
We need to focus on Math, English, and Science nothing else. It is wrong to force children to learn something that some parents don't want them to teach. Pretty soon we will all be force to learn Islam.
"Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it." – George Santayana
You have to teach History too.
By your logic with all the hate toward religion we need to teach religion in schools.
When will we start to teach our children about the interracial relationships that our founding fathers were in? Seems just as important to me.
How about we teach them about the Africans that captured their brothers and sold them into slavery.
Julius Caesar did it. J. Edgar Hoover, maybe. This could be a fascinating topic.
OSCAR WILDE ALEXANDER THE GREAT. EVERY BODY WAS GAY
While kids in other countries overtake our kids in math, science, reading, and writing...
Who cares if our kids can't find jobs as adults, at least they will be tolerant.
!
Forcing us to spend money on this is one more nail in coffin for this state – overhead pure and simple. i'm moving far away from this state if my home equity ever comes back.
Move to THE MIDDLE EAST THEIR THE BEST EXAMPLE OF RELIGIOUS FREEDOM'S
Education is not a zero sum game. Including one thing does not necessarily exclude another. Seting up the debate in such a way is intellectually dishonest
I don't see any harm in adding books to required reading regardless of topic, as long as they don't encourage hatred of each other. I guess that rules out Obama's book where he advocates hatred of half the country huh...
Totally factless statement. Quit making things up. Learn reading comprehension.
The day will come that a student will not pass unless they perform an act with the opposite.
We should teach tolerance, but this is plain nuts, in a state that taxes its citizens like no other, with a failing school system, they have much more important issues to resolve. But not surprizing that they go down this path instead of working on the tough issues such as a sound education. After all california is just a microcosim of the US, where we pay way too much attention to minor issues while the economy is falling apart.
The tough thing about gays is that if you disagree with them you "hate" them. If I disagree with anyone else, I'm identified as "disagreeing" with them. I'm sure someone will reply to this comment and refer to me as a "hater" now.
And out of no where gays/lesbians/trans have developed more rights than other people (excluding marriage and insurance). This is getting out of hand. As i said I believe they should get equal rights. But not more or better rights. It goes back to whatever you like is what you like. Just don't force it on others. I think this is alsmost they same thing with so called anti semitism. If you disagree with anything that jewish people like you're in trouble and an ass. Its turning that way with gay people. FACT
Exactly
Chad yes this is what the left has done so well since I entered politics in the 70s, spin every disagreement to the most unbelievable extreme...any reduction in the suggested Dem increase in social programs was spun for years by Pat Schroeder as "Republicans want to kill children and old people". This is the kind of extremist hate perpetrated by the left for the last 30 years against half of this country that is driving us into the ground.
That's becuase when most people say they "disagree" with gays it means they think it's okay for an employer to fire a gay person just because they or gay
Really? I don't think so. When you say "most", you obviously don't have any idea what you are talking about.
I can be fired on the spot in most states for saying something my boss doesn't like or posting personal opinion to facebook. It's most often not really a gay thing. Why should any group of people have more protection than others?
Dave,
I doubt that anyone on this blog ever heard that comment before and few IF ANY ever heard of the person. It's nice to fantasize that such ignorance is common, but it isn't. It's Republicans who don't want equal rights and fight against helping the less fortunate.
Hater!!! No, just kidding. You are correct. But let us not forget the name calling from other special groups.
"But I permit not a woman to teach, nor to have authority over the man, but to be in silence." 1 Timothy 2:12
We need laws to get women back in the kitchen with their mouths shut, since we're basing our morals on the Bible.
"Both thy bondmen, and thy bondmaids, which thou shalt have, shall be of the heathen that are round about you; of them shall ye buy bondmen and bondmaids." Leviticus 25:44
And let's bring back slavery while we're at it.
Timothy was no dummy
Timothy said that men shouldn't have s-x with women. He said that marriage was just for those who couldn't control their lust.
Observer, Paul wrote the letter, not Timothy. Your ignorance is showing.
Man really?. Good luck with that......
I normally dont comment on these boards but I see you MFS need a life.....
Peaec and it stays loaded come on wit it.
.
Matthew Shepard was murdered in 1998 not 1985.
mary stachowicz was murdered in 2002
What the people pushing this as part of our culture do not understand or accept is that for many of us, the LGBT movement is just one more step toward immorality being mainstreamed. Take all the arguements for allowing gay marriage and you can apply them to incestual or polygomous marriage. Does that mean in 10, 20 or 30 years that these groups (and they do exist) wil be pushing for their cause to be normalized? This is NOT about civil rights. This is about where do we draw the line? If society approves of everything, in time we will live in an "anything and everything is ok" society and then society will fall apart into anarchy. It has already begun in some ways.
Yes
The use of the word immorality suggests you are a Christian idiot. What is one's morality is not necessarily another's
The Godless on speaks
why are you such a bigot against christians? Gays are so biggoted and anti-family. Why?
you're right, YOUR god is not my god. I am proud of that you ignoramous
lol, I am not gay. But hey, thanks for pigeonholing.
rkdres – you are a hater/bigot. leave normal people alone.
Your right about one person's morals not being everyone's personal morals, but your lack of tolerance toward people of religious convictions is no more valid. If Christians started calling LGTBs idiots, they would be called bigots. What are you?
Why do you have such a problem staying on topic? We are not talking about incest and not talking about polygamy. Quit PRETENDING it's a different topic. You're just trying to change the subject to try to make things "worse".
Tony is right. Where does society cross the line? Will society start forcing people to accept molestation, rape, beastiality, ect..... being gay is just plain wrong and should not be shoved down our childrens throat. Who is going to protect the children now?
moderatesense- Your comment throughout here show your ignorance and to compare LGBT to molestation and rape shows how out of touch with reality you really are. We are just one of many species that show such behavior and despite what you may think being gay is not a choice. Why did you choose to be straight? You didn't. Who would choose to be discriminated against? I'm not gay, I just happen to think we should treat all people equally. I can agree with other's comments that the school should be more focused on math, science, etc but I could also ask why so many want to shove religion down our children's throats. Let our children make informed decisions. But the argument will likely be that LGBT is wrong because the bible said (insert overused verse to suit your own prejudices). Well God made man in his image, some of man shows LGBT tendencies...therefore God must show those same tendencies and believing in God is "just plain wrong."
The polygamist in Arizona are in fact cheering these laws on. They are hoping gay marriage will become the law of the land. One of the groups plans to take their lack of equal protection under the law to the supreme court. It is all connected.
Also, why do the LGTB groups keep equating their lack of rights to the civil rights movement in the 1960?
You mean like a society full of gluttons . or the society that says it's ok to gamble even though it's a sin
Wow Ur smart. Lets compare a behavior which is counter productive to society to gambling. Since you are bringing up the "sin" argument, why are you biggoted toward anyone with an inkling of religious values?
What is your basis for calling gambling a sin? Define gambling.
Rkdres's use of moral equivalency suggests he is a pagan imbecile.
SciGuy, you might want to think about using those negative words to describe Pagans. I much prefer a Pagan in my corner than a so called christian! Talk about dumb... But, the subject here is unnatural behavior and teaching that to our kids, I for one do not like that.
Don"t pay baatman74 any attention. He is just a bigot.
I don't hate gay people, I just think something is just not quite right.
I don't hate women. I just think they need to keep their mouths shut and stay home and cook and make babies.
And what's wrong with that?
Maybe the world would be better if we had more stay at home mothers.
You could pick the Golden Rule from the Bible, but instead you choose to put people down. It's all pick and choose.
If your religion makes your life better, don't use it to make someone's life worth.
Religion is a moral guideline. Why are gays so biggoted?
She really didn't put anyone down, if you re-read her comment. She just said she thinks something isn't quite right.
"worse" not "worth"
You're not just gay and stupid, you also have no education.
Isabel, you got it, something isn't quite righrt here with those people. l&g's are made, not born, scientific observation will prove they would be extinct if in fact they were born. But, who wants facts; 'I don't need no stinking facts...'
What an ignorant thing to say. You clearly have no idea what "science' means.
The seven sins you should check to see you don't fall under.
1)Wrath,
2)Greed,
3)Sloth,
4)Pride,
5)Lust,
6)Envy
7)Gluttony.
James, I plead GUILTY!!! roflmao
Thank goodness not everyone is gay, there would be no children 🙁 Why don't we give the gay folks their own island? They could do whatever they wanted and we could watch them disappear 🙂
That island is north america, so please, move to Iran where you belong.
Ship,
.
Good example of another failure of education. Gays and lesbians can have children. Read a basic biology book.
How nice
they can???? like ...really!?!?! geez...I do need to read up on "how" they can have babies ...
Of course we still have ass backward thinking people like you left alive. I cant wait until your generation dies out. We'll have a more tolerant America and we can begin looking foward instead of holding onto insecurities.
So you just can't wait for a more tolerant America. Thats the pressing need of the moment. You know, there are some pretty intolerant countries in this world that are building nuclear bombs, inventing cutting edge technologies and are far ahead of American children in terms of education. And you are worried about intolerance? Get a real education you shmuck and quit defending disgusting behavior.
love your name!!! zombi3 🙂
I thought we weren't supposed to make distinctions and put people into groups. But the Sodomites aren't happy unless their perverted behavior is accepted as normal by society.
CNN is engaging in some serious censorship today. Time to frequent another news site, along with their sponsors.
Yes they are. My comment has not been posted. Oh well. Maybe if I were Gay it would of been posted????
I have been blocked a few times. Lots of powerfull gay people work at CNN.
Yes, if you are any kind of independent thinker, you are not welcome on CNN. It's sad. And the consider themselves journalists. It's laughable.
Interesting that the thought police are up in arms about this, but see no problem with pushing their religious dogma onto our children ...
The thought police are those pushing the LGBT agenda. If an indivdual or group stands up in opposition to these sorts of things, they are branded as evil, discriminating and told they are modern day opposers of civil rights. The thought police, who are on the side of the LGBT community, do not allow an honest discussion on whether or not this is good and right for our society.
Huh ...
And here I thought we WERE having an honest and open discussion about the issue – I don't see anyone preventing you from stating your opinion. What you're really after is the removal of this discussion from public forums – policing thought – based on your narrow interpretation of morality.
If there's something wrong with putting religion on children, then there's problems with telling them to do the right things, and not the wrong ones. And also, don't force on your children that religion is wrong. Be a good parent, and don't force them to make the wrong decisions. Let them make their own good decisions, such as going to church.
Matthew Shepard was killed in 1998, not 1985.
and if the schools want to teach this fine. my kid will be excused from it
Then they will fail that day, a big failure for them and their whole lives.
If you think that it's a failure, you're parents obviously never gave you an education. Way to go for them.
Excuse them from african american history and the women's movement then. Fostering ignorance won't improve your kids lives
Please don't equate LGBT studies with African American history. There are no similarities. Thanks, Ryan.
Why public funding is being used to promote certain social behaviors? I am offended. Should good liberals are taught not to offense anyone? California is sick to the core.
These are marginalize people, not behaviors. Until you recognize that you can't add to the discussion
You mean finally we will have the REAL history taught?
What was being taught before? Imaginary history?
"imaginary history" <= correct
Why don't the books just let the accomplishments and their impact on the world dictate what's discussed? Being gay or straight, black or white, isn't an accomplishment. Kids will [eventually] see through this ridiculous social engineering ploy.
Correct answer. Congrats.
I will humor your ignorance for a moment. Do you really think that history works based on the truth of accomplishments? In the 1910s history class did you think it was just coincidence that there were no black people or women mentioned. I guess they didn’t have any accomplishments up to that point. (sarcasm warning… sarcasm coming soon.. for you not-so-bright people….) stupid women, never went to the voting booth until 1920s… all the voting they wasted and all they had to do was show up….
Seriously? Its wrong wrong wrong . If it comes to my state, my kids will be home schooled.
Truth always wins. You can try and hide from it. But truth will always prevail.
If someone is being discussed in a classroom it should be for their accomplishments, their bedroom habits have nothing to do with it.
Exactly Matt. Its not as if every time a straight person who accomplished something is taught about, the teachers pauses to say, "And guess what? They were straight! Isn't that awesome?"
I don't think dogs are properly represented in the history curriculum taught in the public schools. Think of the contributions to our society by Lassie and Old Yeller and Snoopy. These fine animals deserve recognition. Let's reduce the time our children spend studying Jefferson, Einstein, and Reagan and focus on this underrepresented class. Who's with me?
I'd prefer Snoopy to Reagan.
Woof! Woof woof, growl, woof woof, bark, bark, BARK!!
I'm with you! H–l yes, we need more Alice In Wonderland, more The Wizard of Oz, how about them neglected Portabella Sroons? lord have mercy, how do kids survive not knowing how to pick up dog poop when it craps in the yard? lmao
Here's what I don't get. None of the people who are straight are highlighted specifically because they were straight. They had to have accomplished something.
History doesn't need affirmative action to "even the field". History simply is.
True. And the fact that famous and note-worthy gays were gay is always hidden. Much of this will be to "out" them historically to make the point that gays are and always have been, always will be, a contributing force in our society, and are just like everyone else: solid, decent, contributors to our world. Not mentioning that str8 people in history were str8 makes sense because our society assumes, and forces hetero on everyone. THe point is to tell it like it is...that not everyone is str8 and to stop hiding the reality. Stop the hatred that so quickly popped up on this site the instant biggots heard that CA is finally going to tell the truth. To the bible thumpers: read Leviticus and Exodus...ALL OF IT and follow all of it, then slam gays. Let me set the price for your child when I want to buy your child, and all that stuff. Stop the pick-and-choose bible readings.
Did you ask Alexander the Great if he wanted to be remembered for being gay? Did you ask these historical figures if it was ok to be outed? What if you make a mistake and out someone who was not gay?
It's 2011, stop using a book of fairy tales as justification for your hate of people different than yourself.
It's a book of truth, you're so far gone you don't see it.
Truth and contradiction do not mean the same thing.
It's a book of morals that was written by man and so it also contains errors, contradictions, hypocrisy and nonsense.
Hate? You hate lots of people, you bigot.
Great contributions like what? Vaseline? The reach-around? You libtards act as if one gay persons achievement is somehow all gay peoples accomplishment. No wonder California is broke.
This is pathetic. Historical figures should be recognized based on their contributions to history, not because of their race, gender, or orientation. And our kids don't need to be taught a moral worldview by the public schools - if they won't allow prayer in, they shouldn't allow this LGBT stuff in, either.
So talking to imaginary friends is on the same level as teaching children about real things that real people have actually done?
and gays wonder why the world hates them?
What that haterd does began>
The hubris of Humanity knows no bounds.
And people wonder why there kids can't read, write or do simple math
Clearly your education without LGBT curriculum wasn't sufficient, since you don't know the difference between "their" and "there".
"your" just saying that because you are gay
*their... you can't write
or in your case, spell...
*their. I guess you missed that elementary school lesson too.
"Jesus accepted everyone!!!! When will these idiots learn the New Testament." Jesus accepted everyone, but he also expected them to repent of whatever behavior he considered sinful. "Go forth and sin no more," he said. The New Testament clearly defines that (1) all hanky-panky outside of marriage is wrong and (2) marriage is between a man and a woman only. So people who engage in gay hanky-panky are sinning without exception.
Hitler killed a lot of gays, I'm told the Pink Triangle (gay symbol) started in Nazi Germany and that's how Hitler marked lesbians. Many gays recognize the triangle as a gay symbol but I'm not sure they know why. I didn't know for a long time. G-d knows II was not taught that pary of WW2 history in Jr. High or High School.
Even more, I dont think many people at all know that when concentration camps were liberated after the war, Eisenhower told them to leave the gays locked up because they are "criminals".
This is a wonderful example of the ways in which lgbt history should be included in a high school curriculum. I agree with the article that there are some definite parallels between the history of discrimination against African Americans and that against the lgbt community. I learned about slavery in school, and felt empathy for what had happened to a race of people because of the color of their skin. Why not teach children and teenagers about other types of people that have been discriminated against because of traits they have no control over? Maybe future generations will be just as horrified about the negative ways in which so many people think about and act towards lgbt people, as i was when i studied slavery.
GOD help us !!!
The Bible says that heteros who remarry commit adultery, but don't expect hypocritical Christians to talk about that.
I agree
It's all part of the plan to take Christ out of this world. First it was Merry Christmas and now it's
Happy Holidays. Seems like they want to take God out of everything. Prayer in the school is prohibited
yet we celebrate the gay lifestyle. What's wrong with the world today? Wake up sheep!
Wake up yourself. Start picking on adulterous Christians first. There's FAR more of them.
LOL
Sounds like you might be the one behaving like a sheep, Isabel. Look a little deeper into your own beliefs and you'll why.
You believe in 2000 year old fairy tales & you're telling others to wake up & that they're sheep? lol Good stuff.
The term Social Science is an oxymoron.
Your post exposes your ignorance on the subject.
just another distraction to divert our attention from the globalist banksters raping our nation's economy.
Bankers are going to the "brown-town" on our "back-sides."
You go your way and I'll go mine, but don't cram it down my throat..no pun intended.
You're talking about religion, right?
Really? Just think about it for a second. Being gay is WRONG. So teach that.
Even kids recognize it.
Being a bigot is far worse.
And the world wonders why gays hate them! This is disgusting and being forced down our childrens throats with our own tax dollars.
This makes me sick and why are our children forced to learn this behavior. Why are not the Christians standing up for what we believe in? By staying silent we are contributing to this crime and we will be judged. I will never consider moving to CA because the fact the state is making such actions mandatory. CA will continue to erode and face hardship as they pursue and justify these immoral ways and if you disagree, you can find the facts in the Bible.
Yeah, where are the real Christians today?
Fact in the bible, thats a good one....
Something wrong with the world when gays are openly welcomed in the class room
and prayer is not. The world has become twisted and the blind sheep walk eagerly off the cliff.
Good they can start with Baron Friedrich Wilhelm Von Steuben, the father of the US military!!!!!!!!!
Nice try making up that fact. Why don't you get a real education in stead of making up gay garbage
You are ignorant of our history if you didn't know about Von Steuben.
The Maj. Gen. von Steuben was indeed gay, and so were Alexander Hamilton and the Marquis de La Fayette. George Washington was quite fond of them all.
My study of American history and military history (some of which was in ROTC) covered Von Steuben's contributions in detail. I was not told, howver, if he were gay or straight. Same this is true for George Washington. Gender orientation is not relevant to historical contribution.
The same is not true when we are always taught about George and MARTHA Washington.
Teaching kids that being gay is disgusting. There is nothing right about being gay. Now the gays want to brainwash the kids with our own tax dollars. And Gays wonder why the world hates them!
Glad I don't live in California. I have no interest in teaching my child about crap like that.
Why don't they teach reading, writing, and arithmetic?
Because history is important too?
They do.
Social engineering, not teaching, surprise.
Waste of Time and Money. Need to teach Scocial Culture values.
Um, what's the difference between this and "social culture"?
Definitely more important that learning math.
And we wonder why people in their 20s and 30s don't understand their Credit Card or Mortgage terms.
People now in that age group were never taught gay history, they were taught what everyone seems to be raging about yet look where we landed. Your comment makes no sense.
Its bad enough Hollywood is force feeding us this perversion. Now its on to schoolchildren...
I wonder how Kali kids stand on average in math, science, reading comprehension, etc...compared to peers in other states and worldwide?
Now you know why the Left rants against homeschooling. This is the clearest example of a solidly 'progressive' – controlled region of governance using public schools as a tool of indoctrination vice pure education. In a way , it's good as a warning to the rest of America that 'it can happen here....'
And this accomplishes what, now?
We keep struggling to achieve higher and higher standards of tolerance (which we already enjoy, compared to many, many other countries)... how about achieving higher and higher standards for math and science?
So glad I moved out of CA 12 years ago. When I went to school there, Spanish was being shoved down our throats. Now, LGBT issues are being shoved down the students' throats. What a waste of taxpayer dollars. How about a focus on math and science - you know, something that can actually help students get into college and have a bright future.
Is this for real? Do we actually intentionally exclude these people from school curriculum? That's messed up....
I'm sick and tired of the biggoted gays hating families. Just because they can't have kids from sticking things up their anus's doesn't mean they can destroy our families. Why do gays hate families?
B/c they don't hate. It's you that hates.
We don't exclude teaching about people who were gay or lesbian, but we don't make a point of pointing out their orientation. If a historical figure known for his political leadership, or military prowess, or contributions to science, happened to be straight or gay or was into fat chicks or whatever, that was considered irrelevant. Now, if he was gay, it's somehow relevant, and needs to be pointed out.
1985 murder of gay Wyoming college student, Matthew Shepard.
Year needs to be updated
1988.
Matthew Sheppard happened in the '90's. Get your decade straight. Young Matthew Sheppard didn't deserve to die, but he wasn't all that innocent either when he approached his future killers.
This is a form of social programming. In one way or another, we are all programmed. The only thing that ever changes are the hands that write the programs.
Programming is telling people what they can't learn or be exposed to. Expanding the reading list is better for society than censoring.
that was a thoughtful reply, Ryan. But I must add that expanding and mandating are two very different things indeed.
Agreed, but marginalized people can not even be part of the discussion without what you charcterize as a mandate
It is about time that all people are recognized. The phony Christians, evangelical idiots, may eventually learn to be real Christians and accept everyone. I am not gay, but know many gay people who are better people and contributors to our society than the phonies who are bigotted about gay people. It is time their pastors learned and preached Christianity. Jesus accepted everyone!!!! When will these idiots learn the New Testament.
It appears that we read different Bibles. Show me where in the Bible it says a man can marry a man or a woman can marry a woman. Before you quote the Bible – READ IT and UNDERSTAND IT! I am not judging you because as a sinner, I am not able to cast a stone but know that one day your judgment will come. I don’t know when that will be but I know it will happen.
That's the big fallacy that many people are trying to promote and are so quick to accept. Jesus did NOT accept everyone. Jesus LOVES everyone and has provided a way that all "can" (not "will") be forgiven of their sins and enter heaven. Jesus said "If ye love me, keep my commandments" along with the imperative "Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect." So if we love Christ, we make an effort to live as he would live and repent and try again when we fall short. Christ would not have commanded us to be perfect if it were not achieveable at some point in our eternal existence. All people will be resurrected. That is a free gift of Christ to everyone who ever came to earth. However, not all people will live with God the Father in heaven. That gift is contingent on the decisions we make during our life. Jesus' love toward us is unconditional. Eternal life with God in heaven is not unconditional and telling people that "it doesn't matter how you live your life, Jesus loves all of us so we'll all go to heaven" is false and lulls people into a false sense of security and release from responsibility for their sins and wrong-doing.
Blalalalalalalalaa, and on and on and on with your fairy tales.... If you're scared.... go to Church...
"Eternal life with God in heaven is not unconditional..." What kind of miserable existence do you have that you devote yourself to a God that can’t even match the love of a lesser human parent to their children?
Walter, you pick and chose what to believe in your bible. I suggest you read it again, especially John 3:16
Amen!
Nice one.
mabear, Please show me in the bible where Jesus accepted "everyone". He was against sin and sinners, that is not acceptance. He believed in fogiveness and second chances but he did not accept their life choices. You might want to open a Bible and read it.
Jesus did not like those who commit adultery as per the Seventh Commandment of God and that sure addresses loads of your straight counterparts now doesn't it! Why don't you start with them first you bigoted hypocrite!