Opinion: Virginia wants to deny our family exists
Editor’s Note: Daniel Gri and James Abbott have been a couple for more than 15 years. They had a religious commitment ceremony in 1999, and were legally married in California in 2008. They are raising two sons, aged 14 and 12, in Virginia.
By Daniel Gri and James Abbott, Special to CNN
Our family lives in a state where our existence is about to be denied.
We certainly know who we are. We are a loving couple raising two children. We are people of faith. We are involved actively in conservative political causes. And there’s no denying that friends, neighbors and even complete strangers can see who we are. Like us or not, we’re two gay, middle-aged, white dads raising two adopted children who needed homes: one bi-racial teen and one black pre-teen.
But Virginia is now prepared to ignore us – and hundreds of loving couples like us who could provide loving and stable homes to thousands of unwanted children who are in need of homes, too.
In a few days, our state is expected to become only the second in the nation (North Dakota is the first) that will allow state-funded adoption agencies to deny us, and other qualified parents, the ability to foster or adopt children solely because of our sexual orientation.
Supporters of the bill call it the “conscience clause,” but what it does is unconscionable. It allows private adoption agencies, many who contract with the state to place children in adoptive or foster homes, to deny prospective parents because of their sexual orientation. The bill passed the state Senate last week, but has not yet been signed into law by the Governor.
How did our family get to this place - a state were a group of 140 men and women pass a bill that says it’s OK to ignore or deny the existence of our family?
Well we, along with our two children 14-year old Caleb and 12-year old Alfred, moved to Oakton,Virginia from California in 2004. We loved the bucolic beauty of the area, the great schools and the sense of community we instantly felt from our neighbors and the people at our church.
Our family fully understood the legal limitations we would encounter as a gay couple in Virginia, even before this adoption measure was proposed. In California, we were legally married. Here, the law does not respect the sanctity or reality of our marriage. In California, we were welcomed and encouraged to become adoptive parents by the foster care system. Here, since the state doesn’t recognize our marriage, and marriage is required to adopt children as a couple, we would have been prohibited from adopting our two beautiful sons.
But now the legislation has passed and if signed into law, as expected, it will explicitly deny the fact that we, and thousands of other qualified people, are already good parents and can be good parents to other children in need.
How can they deny the reality of our family?
More importantly, how can Virginia deny the 1,300 foster children waiting for adoption? How can they deny them good homes based on some social worker’s vague moral or religious objection? What about our religious beliefs?
We did not choose to be gay. When each of us realized we were gay, we both asked God why. We believe gay people are made for good reasons. One reason is to help take care of all the children from straight people who are not ready to be parents.
We did not adopt our sons to make a political statement. We adopted our sons because we had a stable home and could provide a circle of boundless love to children who, because of their age and race, in all likelihood would not have been adopted. Our sons were 3 years old when they entered our lives. Statistics demonstrate that that the older a child gets, the less likely they are to be adopted. Without our act of love, it is possible that these beautiful, active boys would be living in foster care or group homes.
Instead, today our sons are honor students in their respective Fairfax County schools. They play football, baseball, and sing in our church’s choir. In January, they had the opportunity to ski in Stowe,Vermont and have travelled to Eastern Europe, Italy, Panama and Mexico. Last summer we visited historic sites in New England on our way to a quiet week in a cabin on an island off the coast of Maine.
Most importantly our sons are loved, supported and encouraged. We look into the eyes of our boys, soon to be young men, and realize that if they were part of the Virginia foster care system, they would have been denied a home with us – their dads. And we – all four of us together– would have been denied the opportunity to become the loving, nurturing family that we are.
The opinions expressed are solely those of Daniel Gri and James Abbott.
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Sad how some people act here, so nasty. life is too short who really cares if 2 men want to raise kids bettter than being stuck in foster care.
You knew what VA's laws were BEFORE you moved there. You made the choice to accept their laws when you made the choice to move there. You are a family. I won't disagree with that statement; however you are NOT married in the eyes of VA law.
You guys look like a very nice family. Stay strong.
I just want to say one thing." F a g s don't make good dads"
Do you have any FACTS that back that up? Or, are you simply spouting off opinions based on ignorance? I have seen many cases that indicate your opinions are in fact WRONG.
Now that I have my new job I can say whatever I want without fear of retaliation, does the word Pope ring any bells !
You can't debate without using silly comments and hiding behind a screen name. I am done with you. I just hope that your offspring that is if anybody saw you fit enough to procreate with are smarter than you.
Little guys make sure you lay on your back at night protect yourselves from Fruitloop and Lucky Charms. Be careful little guys.
By your same ignorant and faulty logic.... Little girls should sleep with their legs closed so that their Daddy doesn't rape them while they are sleeping. My, you are a narrow-minded idiot. I hope your children, that is if you have any grow up to be smarter than you.
@Eduardo i think the raping of young boys by your kind has surpassed society expectations there was a time little girls had to watch themselves, but my, times have change as I watch the h o m o s e x u a l i z a t i o n of this great nation and your kind has gooten brazen, we now have little boys who are prey for your kind. PLEASE LEAVE THE LITTLE BOYS ALONE EDUARDO GO TRY AN ANIMAL INSTEAD.
@Eduardo i think the raping of young boys by your kind has surpassed society expectations there was a time little girls had to watch themselves, but my, times have change as I watch the h o m o s e x u a l i z a t i o n of this great nation and your kind has gooten brazen, we now have little boys who are prey for your kind. PLEASE LEAVE THE LITTLE BOYS ALONE EDUARDO GO TRY AN ANIMAL INSTEAD. LEAVE THEM ALONE
i feel sorry for these boys. Hang in there little guys.
You feel sorry that they have a loving home and didn't have to grow up in the foster system? I worked in homes and shelters, and I can tell you that adopted and foster children don't care if their parents are gay. Kids are born without prejudice, but they learn it from jerks like you.
These little guys will never have the opportunity to be with a woman or have s e x with one. All they will know is relationship with men blessed their hearts.
Let the freak show begin! Where do you people who support these freaks want to draw the line? Anybody? If people in a civilized society don't want to celebrate the fact that Adam gets a chubby when he looks at Steve then isn't that our right? Do we have to keep lowering the bar every time a group of these pervs decide that their lifestyle should be accepted? Where do you stop? Keep it in the bedroom and i could care less what you do. Prance around with your butt buddies screaming 'accept us for who we are' and I'm done with you.
they should send a doctor to the house everyday just to make sure
"Keep it in the bedroom"? Do you only reveal your true self in the bedroom? Do you only love your wife when you're in the bedroom? No? Then why should we have to hide our love? If being in love makes one a freak, then I'll be the king of the freaks. And my lifestyle is to give and be my best in all situations and to be devoted to the good of my neighbors and community. I was valedictorian of my class, received high honors and a Masters of Engineering in college, and work for one of the leading Aerospace companies in the world. I am a leader in my fraternity and active in my community and church. It's people like me that are the producers of this country, the ones that drive innovation and promote justice and love for the betterment of all. If these qualities make me a freak, then I will proudly wear my heart on my sleeve. Because by God, I've got a heart of gold, as do so many other people you consider less than yourself.
..........Whats so good about an AIDS factory??????
Virginia's Official Old Motto was "Virginia is for Lovers" and has now been replaced with "Virginia is for Haters!"
I have never before heard Oakton, Virginia, described as "bucolic."
I would like to know why a social worker would ever support this type of discrimination. Our entire point of being is to fight for equality and give love to those who are denied it by the majority.
I feel for you and your family, but why on earth would any gay couple be "conservative?" Thee conservative values platform denies virtually all of the gay issues: marriage, family, lifestyle, & legal and economic protections of all sorts for people like you. You are dismayed, surprised, and offended: why is anything surprising here for you? As a straight man who is a fervent supporter of family and marital equality for all, I at least know which side of the political spectrum to align myself with.
The US is full of poor people and folks disadvantaged in all sorts of ways who repeatedly insist on voting for the powers and politics whose sole purpose is to deny them rights and equal opportunity. Why vote against your own interests?!
I am saddened by all the intolerance and hate I'm seeing here. I am more saddened by the justifications I'm seeing for it.
I would honestly bet that if you people spewing all this hate were in a life threatening situation, the people you spend so much time hating would probably try their best to save you. Somehow, I don't get the feeling you would do the same for them if the situation were reversed. That's a real shame.
I love how these posters keep saying "the kids would rather stay in foster care" or "they would rather have a mother and father". Im sorry but do you know these kids personally? Are you related to them? If so then why are you not taking care of them? Look at the picture they are obviously very happy children and Im sure they would rather have someone love them instead of staying in the foster care system being treated as a second class citizens.
Exactly cb, I agree with you. I was a foster kid with my brother in sister and we were in a California State group home with close to 300 other kids. It felt more like a military barracks then anything and there was no resemblance to a family at all. After dark the older kids would prey on the younger ones and nothing could be done.
These people who claim no gay families should adopt kids should either put up or shut up. They want to talk the big talk but provide no resolution themselves and think if they ignore it everything is ok.....it is not. These kids need homes and if there are parents willing to offer them a safe and secure home I don't care what color or orientation they are I say more power to them for doing the right thing.
BTW- Guest I am still waiting on a reply below?
Being conservatives, they supported the very people that passed this legislation and the governor who could make it law. Were they really expecting a different outcome?
Absolutely. You reap what you sow. Maybe they've learned a lesson.
I completely agree. I can't imagine calling myself a conservative (and I sure as he// don't) and being the least bit surprised by this law. My partner and I (15 years also) fought this type of legislation in Arkansas. We (and those aligned with us, including the good people with the ALCU) were successful in having the Arkansas Supreme Court throw it out; So despite voting for conservatives, perhaps these gentlemen will follow our lead and be part of the solution now. Politics, more often than not, is a package deal and conservatives are not on their side.
You people should go sometime to an orphanage for children. Go there at night. Stand in the ward and listen to children cry themselves to sleep because they know, they have NO ONE. In the morning they will get up and eat whatever 80 to 100 other children get to eat. They will wear clothing that belonged to someone else. They will wear shoes that belonged to someone else. They don't have too many "toys" or things that they can call their own, "the toys are for everybody". If anything, children learn about socialism and the denial of the individual, in a place like this.
Now these boys are not having to shower in a big gymnasium-looking place; they have their very own private, clean bathroom. Their things are not taken or torn-up by other children, there's a safe place for their belongings, and now they HAVE BELONGINGS. That's so important to a child, to have their very own "stuff". And now they have that, and so much more.
Who can deny these boys what they have? WHO DARES TO DENY THESE CHILDREN THE ONLY REAL HOME THEY HAVE?
Oh – I get it: It doesn't "look right" to some of you. And because it doesn't "look right" to some of you, you want them returned to the orphanage and you want them herded around like a bunch of cattle, until they turn 18. And what then? What becomes of children who never learn how to operate within the framework of a family? Oh, that doesn't bother you, does it? You won't have to "look" at THAT, will you?
Very well written, thank you!
nice post sophie!!
I don't see a problem with letting them adopt is there isn't a willing "normal" couple to do so. It isn't fair to subject a kid to the tormant and bullying they will get because of their two "daddies". This is just not "normal" no matter how much the advocates and the bleeding hearts may want you to believe.
Intolerance is not 'normal' you intellectually delayed bigot.
Who is to say what is "normal". If the majority gets to say then I suppose growing up with Mom living in one house and Dad in another house is "normal" considering the state of marriage and the rate of divorce in 2011.
I would prefer a foster child being adopted to a gay couple than continue to live "in the system" as so many often do until they reach adulthood. To me "living in the system" whether in an orphanage or jumping from foster home to foster home is "not" normal and is in fact unacceptable if a family (gay or straight) is able and willing to adopt.
the only reason these kids get bullied & lead such miserable lives- is because people like YOU that refuse to teach their own children (ie- the BULLIES) to not treat others that way. Your haterid inspires your children. You ought to be ashamed! "Persuit of happiness" does that NOT include the RIGHT to marrry the person (adult, consentual, non-blood relative) you LOVE?
This family wants to be denied because the people in charge don't really care what happens to children. They don't want them in homes of their own but instead would like to have power and control over others.
If you don't think this is true, look at how some elements in the country want to outlaw as many kinds of birth control as they can. It would be nice if all the holy people of this country quit using their books to bash other people and could manage to stay out of people's personal lives. Quit trying to force the people in this country back into the serfdom of the Dark Ages.
EVERYONE DOES KNOW THAT JEWISH, MUSLIM, HINDU, MANY AGNOSTICS FEEL AND THE SAME WAY AS CHRISTIANS ON THIS SUBJECT....BUT YET CHRISTIANS ARE THE ONLY ONES BEING BASHED. PLEASE ANYONE LOGICALLY EXPLAIN?
Because Christians are the only ones in here using their faith loudly for their bigotry.....and yes I am a Christian
Bigotry is the Republican core value.
Historically, the facists, racists, slave owners, have always been Democrats. Not Republicans. You might consider looking at the real world instead of reading revisionist liberal history.
"Historically, the facists, racists, slave owners, have always been Democrats. Not Republicans. You might consider looking at the real world instead of reading revisionist liberal history."
@ Guest : And since the Christian Collition of the Reagan Era, the Republicans have been sounding more and more like the Democrats of the early twenteth century – at least according to their political talking points. Both parties have changed their views over time. You can look at the historical record, but that will have as much to do with modern political positions as the Greek polis have to do with the Electorial College.
@guest: That was true until the Dixiecrat movement. Yes, the true party of Lincoln were liberal and the Democrats of Jackson were what we would today consider "To the right". But, due to the courage of FDR, Truman and JFK, the tides turned.
This kind of experimentation with the lives of children is vile. In this instance they might get lucky and be ok. But the odds are against them. Children need a father and a mother that love and want their children. Not two male liberals that are like two women. Kids must feel like they are living in the twilight zone.
dont be a fool, these kids arent going to wake up one day and decide, gee I feel like gobbling c#$k from now on. It is not a choice that anyone can help, anymore than you can help being a small-minded hack. Welcome to human nature and genetics, you cant pray it away
Sorry durundal, I forgot you don't read. Read each word slowly. Try to sound them out. I am concerned about emotional well-being not some magic gay making brain washing. Children do better with a loving mother and father. Not a liberal experiment.
Really? So let me understand this...if you are really against this then you and thousands of other families are ready to step it up and start adopting all these kids that sit in these state homes without parents right? You are ready to shell out the money, time and energy to bring them into all your homes and provide a life for them as parents?
You see I know better, you talk this big talk about how wrong it is yet you provide no resolution. You make this claim about the "poor children" and how we need to protect them yet when asked to help you put blinders on. It becomes someone else's issue and problem and it doesn't exist if you simply ignore it.
Pretty sad isn't it to admit your a failure and the views you portray to your kids if you have any is of intolerance and hate.
For the record, I was adopted by a straight couple who proceeded to cheat on each other and fight all the time and eventually divorced....yep great role models. I have taken in foster children into my home for 20 years now and given them the chances others refused too. I am straight but would support a gay family adopting. When I see this 8 year old boy in my home right now because his grandparents, 7 aunts, 6 uncles all refuse to let him into their homes because their kin is a handful it makes me ill and reminds me of people like you.
If you can't step up then it makes you no better then the rest of the haters in the world.
"Children do better with a father and mother". Back that up. Where are the statistics. Oh, wait, you don't have any...
You might consider looking at the real world. It's that place outside the window, not a bunch of internet nonsence and manipulated statistics.
Guest- Maybe it is you who should see the real world. How many gay people are you friends with? How many do you truly know and have gotten to know? The fact is you are probably making assumptions based on a narrow vision without really taking the time to meet someone, learn and grow.
Wow you really are thick. Mother/Father, Father/Father or Mother/Mother but ALL loving/caring couples who are willing to share that love with an adoptive child is FAR better than the child continuing to live in the foster care environment. STOP YOUR BIGOTRY and GET OFF YOUR BIBLICAL HIGH HORSE.
It says right in the beginning of the article that they are conservative. Howsabout YOU read the article word by word?
Virginia says you are not a family because you are not a family. President Santorum will outlaw such evil nationwide.
Yes the trolls do feed in the morning.....sigh
My guess is that you would be lost no matter where you are.
Guest- I seem to have articulated exactly what was my belief and understanding.....all you have spouted off with is hate and no resolution. Stop being a part of the problem and try to grow up and provide resolutions. The problem with our world is everyone wants to point fingers but when you are needed to help you walk away.
Ah, yes. The Ayatollah Santorum will not only route such evil nationwide, but he will make certain that women know their place in society as broodmares for men to indulge their Viagra & Cialis-fed needs.
I'm so sorry you feel that way. I think you will be very surprised when you find out that the majority of the nation does not have the same fondness for Santorum that you do.
As per the dictionary: "a social unit consisting of one or more adults together with the children they care for." They are a family!
wow never realized how stupid and hateful theses elephants that call them self's republican. they have the right to adopt who ever they want. and you are sick in the mind if you think there molesters. And you have no right to judge there kids or any other kid id bet they both love there parents very much
CNN liberals(which are usually liberals arts dropouts) want to make it seem as though this is just a Christian thing. I'm agnostic, and I don't believe it's in the kids best interests to be adopted by gay men or gay women. Their is so much whining about Christians here and how much you hate them. Little boys don't want to be adopted by gay parents. Playground can be uncomfortable places when you have to explain that your dads are gay. I believe those kids will grow up fine, they will be productive members of society, but they'd definitely rather be adopted by a hetero couple. To deny that is to know nothing about how a little boy thinks. He want to be like the kids around him. Call that bigoted if it makes you feel better. It's the way things are.
This is the most asinine load of codswallop I've heard in a decade. So if the parents aren't some cookie cutter Stepford people then they cannot adopt? By the way Whose cookie cutter are you using? Playground bullies seek out difference to exploit but are we really going to decide the fitness of a parent based on their lack of things to tease about? And your inference that BOYS do not want to be adopted by Gay men is just stupid and vile. Children want families, children want a home with people who will love and nurture them. Frankly your protestations of agnosticism just reinforce the Fundamentalist problem. You have a complicated relationship with your sky daddy so you project, all the while claiming no Fundie bias. Were you an atheist coming from some reasoned position I might ask you to further develop your argument but you already have two strikes against you and I don't feel like fighting with the unarmed.
seconded, and for the record Andrew, more social sciences and regular sciences, and also far from dropouts....Swing and a miss
Does make me wonder do they take into account what the kids want at the time? Never adopted so just asking.
well kashic, I suspect that if the kids are adopted when they are young they are essentially unbiased in the matter because they have not been molded by their environment. In that case it would be more than likely that they would find it curious and then move on. HOWEVER, once you put those children in with others, who are contaminated by their own parents views and opinions (kids are impressionable) its anyone's guess what will happen (meaning it depends on what the other children are taught about the subject). If mommy and daddy are intolerant little thumpers, three guesses what their little spawn is going to lean towards on the social scale
I do find it amazing that intolerance is the word used when i thought in america we are all allowed to have an opinion. If you do you are a racist or what not. Seems to be no middle ground for live and let live in this world. Yes i am a Christain , but all will be sorted after we all die that isn't my disicision on who should be judged.
Children should get what they need (meaning a safe home and caring parents, straight or gay), not necessarily what they want. Unfortunately it is too often the immaturity and childish pettiness of the grown-ups that harms these children's chances of actually getting the family they need.
To the comment from earlier that "little boys do not want to be adopted by gay parents" I have to wholeheartedly disagree with your insame, ignorant, and uneducated comment.
I am gay and my parenter of almost 16 years and I adopted two boys whose hetero parents negelcted them so bad that the bio-mother ended up in prison. From the mouth of our 7-year son earlier this week (five moths after adopting him): "I wish you and Daddy had taken care of me from birth."
Now, tell me you idiot if your comment still holds water.
Liberals position on gay parent raising children is the most uneducated, silly, progressive for the sake of progressivism sad state. Does anybody think that two teenage boys want to be adopted by gay men or lesbian feminist women. They would rather wait another year in foster care and get a regular family. I'm agnostic, not christian, and I'm only looking out for the best interests of the child. Not the best interests of gay people. My sister is a lesbian feminist who tried to adopt a boy, but the boy didn't want it. He was being teased at school, my sister and her partner had nothing in common with him, and he decided not to go with them. Best decision he ever made I'm guessing.
People like you disgust me. I would support any law to keep people like this Andrew fellow to keep from reproducing or adopting children. Those are rights I'm ok denying.
To the gay couple with the two boys – you have a lovely family. I'm sorry life isn't easy – but I imagine facing this sort of adversity will only make your children stronger men in the future. I look forward to what they will accomplish.
Why do they disgust you? You didn't offer any counter to his argument. Based on your screen name I'm guessing you're educated. Can't you offer a logical argument why he's wrong?
Amazing you blast christains harping about them being hateful but you sound just like them yourselves while you are bashing them.
Oh, but you see, that's okay. It's okay for them to be hypocrites and call everyone else out on anything, because liberal atheists are always right about everything and anyone who disagrees with them is considered stupid and uneducated.
That said, I think it's fine for gays to adopt children from the foster care system. I don't think those kids are any more likely to become gay than anyone else, and it would be a much more stable environment than most foster situations. Hey, but I'm Christian, so my opinion doesn't really count.
I'm sorry the state is going to keep two gay men from getting more little boys in their house. I don't know why anyone would have a problem with that.
Being gay doesn't make you a child molester...
Seriously is right. There are plenty of men out there who are married men with children who think nothing of molesting them and their friends and any other child that crosses their path and interests them. A gay man isn't anymore likely (an I would hazard a guess, not AS likely) to be a child molester as any man claiming to be straight. Let's take a look at some coaches that were recently arrested, shall we?
Curious that they chose not to adopt any girls... Like it or not it's still considered an alternative lifestyle, otherwise known as deviant or not mainstream. As such, I'd argue that this 'couple' needs those kids more than the kids need them – and I have a hard time seeing this as something beyond some sort of bonding exercise for the two men involved rather than a genuine display of their altruistic nature.
There are much larger fish to fry than obsessing over some edge case scenario in gay-white-parent-suburbia.
Very good point.
Unless you are them, how would you even begin to know their reasons for adopting, and how would you even begin to know whether or not the children wanted or needed to be adopted by them? I'd be willing to bet those kids are in a better environment than they were before, with more opportunities than they would ever have had lingering in the foster care system. Unless you have yourself been an adoptee or an adoptive parent, you really have no frame of reference for your opinioin.
It sounds as if you are implying that these gay men wanted these little boys to molest. I guess you forget that the majority of child molesters in the world (check the facts yourself) are men molesting little girls...sometimes their own family members.
My partner and I adopted two boys. Not because that is what we wanted but because that is what was available. We would have gladly accepted two girls or one of each. We love these boys with all our hearts and would do anything for them even protecting them from narrow-minded people who wish to blame others for their lack of parenting skills, their own divorces, and their own failures as a parent.
Eduardo's children will undoubtedly be much more normal, accepting, tolerant and well-adapted to society than Andrew's children, who will grow up in an atmosphere of bigotry and intolerance.
ACk!!! And how convenient that the VA Governor's website currently says that they are experiencing problems with their email system... Someone needs to fix that asap so I can continue to sound off....
This whole string of posts is so sad and shameful. I am confident that this country is better that what this board would suggest. Lets all "Be the change you want to see in the world!" Except I am ONLY talking to the people who embrace tolerance, love, mutual respect, and value the full participation in our society of all cultures, religions, orientations, and genders.... The rest of you may go ahead and scream and cry as you are slowly overshadowed by the voice of reason.
You can value all religion equally. Me, I'm going to actively campaign against those that would like to impose their beliefs on to me. Freedom of religion is freedom from religion. If you want to believe the world is supported by a series of turtles or that the sun is actually a god, that's fine up until you try to force school's to teach that. I see legislation no different than if their religion told them that black people are cursed by god and they were trying to pass legislation against them.
Tolerance doesn't mean allowing bigotry or fascism. You can tolerate Christians without tolerating their bigoted legislation.
75 percent of posts agree with your position, so are you whining that some disagree. I don't want to live in a world where liberalism is mandated and religion is shamed and everybody agrees on everything. You should read Orwell's 1984. Your type of politics shames people for not holding your views. Your gross. And by the way, I'm not Christian if you were about to whine about that.
This would not be the first law in Virginia to disrespect this relationship. Even married men and women who, uh, get oral commit a felony in Virginia.
And the last time someone was arrested and prosecuted for that was? Many States have old and strange laws on the books that have never been repealed, but then they are never enforced either.
Glad you asked – within the last 10 years – look it up.
Lawrence v Texas (2003). Doesn't matter what inane law Virginia still has on the books. Thanks to SCOTUS, those state laws are irrelevant and unenforceable.
Hmm let's see if this posts second time around. Lawrence v Texas was decided based on its discriminatory nature (didn't apply equally to everyone). Virginia's law applies equally to everyone and so is not nullified by Lawrence, and in fact has been enforced and upheld since Lawrence.
Should have just let the Confederate states go. They're welfare states, that is they take more federal money than they ever contribute (true for most Republican dominated states, bunch of Welfare Queens), and they're full of hateful, stupid people. Within a month without support they'll end up a third world country controlled by a theocracy and be indistinguishable from any other Middle-Eastern pit.
Not really. Although I really don't like the fact that these bigoted southern states are in fact a part of our union, imagine the opposite. A theocracy on our southern border. It would be as bad as having Saudi Arabia or Iran as a neighbor. Someday their ignorance and hatred will come to haunt them, I just hope I'm alive to see it.
Ahh, The Bible. Still in the wrong place in every single bookstore. I never see it where it belongs. In the FICTION section!
Right next to the audacity of hope and dreams of my father.
That's because religion and fiction are synonomous and redundant.
You seem to forget New York is a Union state...
You seem to forget that a sizable number of Virginians live in Northern Virginia, and many Northern Virginians work for your Federal Government. Don't be quick to assume that a majority of Virginians support this bill. My guess is that Virginians will make their displeasure known during the next elections. Also keep in mind that Virginia governors can not serve consecutive terms, which leads to all sorts of hijinks since there is no "prudence" check to preserve a chance at re-election. Finally, note that Virginia managed to elect a wacko Attorney General who dragged the state-funded University of Virginia into court because he didn't agree with studies generated by UVA suggesting their was truth to the issue of global warming. Add it up, and get a much more complete picture of reality, and a more clear understanding of the complete ignorance of your statement.
YES! I was shocked to learn that the poorest states in the country have no minimum wage law. These backward swamps need to be dumped ASAP. Florida included. (or perhaps we could just drag them into the 20th Century).
two statements:
1) The day the Bible becomes a federally recognized book of law is the day I will seriously consider it when deciding on my viewpoint of the legality and civil permissibility of a law.
2) In this day and age it is currently my belief that the last true Christian died on a cross.
Could not agree with you more regarding your point about the Bible, but would like to gently and respectfully remind you, that the person who died on that particular cross was a Jew, not a Christian. Not sure who the last true Christian is or was, but it sure was not Jesus.
Quick question to all of the people posting bad things about this family. How many of the violent kids and teens getting arrested and killing other students are the kids being raised by gay families? If anything it's a "typical" straight family you have to worry about. I, personally, am a proud straight married mother of two beautiful boys. I watch the news every day and applaud these two! Married man kills his wife and says he took the kids camping in freezing weather when she went missing then a few years later hacks up his kids and sets his house on fire. Ohio, the boy was left by his parents to be raised by grandparents who didn't see how violent he could become. ANY couple who is in a stable position to raise children in need of a home DESERVES THE RIGHT TO DO IT. Those that are busy posting nasty comments here are those that are unsafe for these kids that need a good home. You're the one with hate in your heart that we should worry about.
Religion is the gateway to justifying stupidity.
Jesus slept in the woods for three years with a dozen other men. Several of those men were hom ose xual. Was Jesus still a virgin? I doubt it.
It is so sad that there are so many racist, closed minded, sick hate filled people in this world. Im talking about you so called christian bigots. These two men are the best thing that ever happened to these two boys. They are blessed to have a happy stable loving home. Anyone who looks at the photo and sees anything more than happiness and a loving family is just plain full of hate and probably are not happy with there own lives. " GOD LOVES EVERYONE " your name calling and ignorant comments are nothing more than modern day racism. I will pray for you.
How can you still be conservatives, when conservatives have taken away your right to be a family? I don't understand people who vote against their own interests.
Look at the list of the places they went on vacation. They are obviously well-off financially and probably prefer deficits to paying taxes. Also, just because they are gay does not mean they don't want to tell others what they can and cannot do with their bodies. Mistreatment does not cause enlightenment.
Speaking as a Democrat... The Republican Party is actually about more than social conservatism and evangelical Christianity ruling all. There are gay people who are republicans, there are pro-choice republicans, there are republcans who support health care for all, and republicans that support(ed) not allowing a religious exemption for health insurance coverage of birth control (see Romney as governor, not Romney as candidate)... It's just that they aren't speaking out against the loud, obnoxious, theocratic republicans currently vying for office. That is the problem in this country, this idea that if ONE person of a particular group, be it religious or political or gender or whatever, says something, that MUST represent all of them. Not all republicans agree with these people. Not all Christians think gay marriage is a problem or that abortion should be outlawed (my Southern Baptist preacher/card carrying Democrat of a step-father being one of them, my very religious Republican grandfather another), but entire groups get forced under the greater umbrella. What isn't happening that should be happening is that the moderates of the Republican Party stepping up, but with this era of partisanship, no one seems to be willing to speak out against what the rest of us see as the insanity of the Republicans as represented by three (or four if you count Paul, though he doesn't make many waves) men.
OMG, those people are totally Sick. Nothing normal about them.
Bet a $100 I can tell which one is the "female", just by looking at the picture.
youre an a$$
I'll bet you've got a lot of experience in that area.
Why, did you get hard?
lol, yeah this is sick. They are raising two boys to become gay, tell me how sick that is? You can see the one in the back is already flaming. Why? He follows what his gay parents do. Great...just what we need more whiny gay people. Marriage is a man and woman, if you cant do that then nobody feels sorry for you.
Following that idiotic reasoning I'd be married to a woman today. I'm the gay son of straight parents. Pentecostal preacher parents. I admire my parents, and wanted to be just like them. But I'm not. I'm gay.
Care to explain how that happened?
I agree. It is enough that the perverts ( and it is a perversion) want to be married.
Please leave kids out of your folie a deux!!!
Ever notice how shifty-eyed mentally defective people are? Look at the picture above!
Amazing that you believe you can see "shifty-eyed" in a still picture.
I'm pretty sure you are the defective one.
Virginia is for haters!
Not really, Only nut lovers like you.
Calling what is sick, well. Calling what is ungodly, religious. Calling what is wrong, right. Is it any wonder we have so many confused children in this nation?
Kinda like calling hate and bigotry, morality. Gotcha.
ew... BURN! What's your comeback for that one WI & DFA?
Your mouth and my retum is made for the same thing. To be used by your same gender lover.
Two sick men, raising what will undoubtably be two sick little boys! Daddy and daddy are likely teaching the boys things like "the smell of poop, should give you a woody, son". Stay out of my neighborhood, you deviates.
Your neighborhood? You mean the trailer park? Don't worry, these men have money so you will never have to worry about them being in your neighborhood.
true, it is not cheap to live in Oakton, Va
Typical response from an uneducated, closed minded white trash bigot.
Sounds a little like a threat to me. I tell you what. I've got a couple of gay Marine buddies in Northern Virginia.
How about you man up and say that sort of thing to their faces?
Follower if Christ??? Christ encountered a gay man, via the Roman Centurian trying to heal his younger male slave, and said of him, 'Never have I seen faith greater than this.' He didn't chirp in with 'now go and sin no more'. Christ also mentions gay men as 'born eunuchs' in Matthew and again does not condemn them.
Ghandi said it best when he stated, 'I like your Christ. I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ.'
This was a reply to "Mrs" but this forum it seems will not let you post the word ho mo se xual.
So true! Christians are the world's biggest hippocrits and bigots, they make their own hell here and here is where they will pay the price, there is nothing after death so be prepared to lead a miserable life here and now!
Religion needs to step out of the way of freedom.
Virginia is nice but the government is not.
We have an idiot for a Governor and legislators as well, off with their heads!
All I can say is more love, less hate. Jesus calls us to love one another and I truly believe when we all stand before the throne of God on that judgment day, we will see whole truly loved God and exemplified His compassion...and the Almighty will say "Well done thy good and faithful servant."....Lord come quickly.
Their is a very simple solution around this. This bill gives the adoptive or foster homes that are raising and taking care of a child the OPTION to say NO to someone that adoptive or foster home does not agree with. That is it, nothing more nothing less, they should have the option to say no.
To go around this find an adoptive or foster home provider that will say YES. If their are none, welcome to America, go and create one! If their is a high enough demand for this you can even create more jobs, win win.
Great explanation as to why discrimination is so American.
Actually, this bill has nothing to do with the foster or adoptive homes saying no. It says that the placement service can deny anyone the right to be a foster or adoptive parent based on the service's religious or moral convictions or policies. So if you don't conform to what they think is moral enough, you can be denied the ability to become a foster or adoptive parent.
JT1962-
Fine replace all the "foster or adoptive homes" with "placement service". The argument still stands, they should have the ability to say no. I am not saying they SHOULD say no, but they should have the ability to say no.
I have the perfect solution. Get in your car, head to Interstate 70, turn left. When it runs into Interstate 80, get on it and head west. If you get to the ocean you've gone too far. If you like California so much, go back there. Nobody made you move to Virginia.
You might have well said "We don't take kindly to your kind around here boy, you better git!"
"We don't take too kindly to your types in these here parts of Ameruca."
G-d, we are a nation of trespassers. We have violated your laws. We have broken the Sabbath continually and the Bible says we should be stoned to death. The Bible told us to observe the Jubilee and forgive the financial debts of others but we should be stoned to death for ignoring that. G-d, forgive us as a nation for our terrible trespasses. We have neglected the poor and needy and our activities are on the verge of destroying this planet. Have mercy on us.
Who are you to tell someone else to live? Why isn't it important to pass laws that do no reflect the most important matter at hand, balancing the budget and getting people back to work,
I like the way you think!!!! If you don't like it, you surely do not have to stay, no one is KEEPING you here. If this such a horrible place with unfriendly government, why would you want to raise your children here? By all means, feel free to go back to Cali. I live in VA and happen to really like the Gov, and his attorney general, they are doing a great job bringing lots of jobs here and being fiscally responsible. But then again, these guys are from Cali, their not used to working within a budget.
Daniel and James represent what a happy and functional family is. They are loving parents whose sons will have advantages unthought of had they been ground up in the foster care system of California. They have demonstrated their committment to eachother in myriad ways. The fact that they cannot be legally recognized is disturbing in these enlightened times. If the great State of Virginia will not allow a marriage why can't a common-law relationship law be made available to cover all legal issues, such as adoption? Thousands of unwanted children are waiting out there and they need to be considered in this issue. I thank the Gri family for their bravery and love.
Soooo, you are people of faith, conservative and live in Virgina? And you are wondering why your rights and lifestyle is being threatened, really? Your or most religions are against you, your political party is against you and your state is against you. Maybe you ought to drop the cult, clearly leave the conservative hate organizations and leave Virgina.
You see that right?
Come out to Oregon. You, your partner and your family would be welcomed with open arms.
Their problem is obvious....They are Gay Republicans. Kind of like being a Jewish Nazi.
If you are gay and support conservative causes, you get no sympathy for me. You're actively supporting a group that goes against your very existence. You're more idiotic than they are.
That's pretty much exactly what I was going to say. That sentence jumped off the page at me. Being gay and supporting conservative causes means you are financially supporting the very people who want to wipe you off the face of the earth.
Yeah, since 1 issue defines a whole political group. Maybe they have conservative views on abortion, economy, military defense, illegal immigration, government size, privatization, oil usage in the US, generally against welfare, 22nd amendment rights, views on church and state (among others).
They can still be considered conservative.
yeah, and i know it is "2nd amendment" not 22nd. lol
I know a lot of gay guys that are like this. I think it's just the need for acceptance and so I don't fault them although I don't understand it either. I don't understand why people want to be a part of something that doesn't want them. Personally, when I come up against that in life I make my own fun!!
Depends on how you define conservative. I would argue that gay equality is a conservative value.
I'm a gay man. I also love guns, abhor the welfare state that is my town of DC, etc.
Again, all depends on your definition of conservative.
Right wing nutjob? No. Conservative on some issues? Yes.
I know several gays who support "conservative causes". They usually have money and lots of it. They tend to have little sympathy for social causes that seek more financial equality, or to advance the cause of racial minorities. I suggest they take their concerns to their local Republican Party representatives, and or, their church. You may not have chosen to be gay, but you DID choose to be socially conservative so you get about as much sympathy as Justice Thomas got when he played the race card during his confirmation hearings. Frankly my dear, I don't give a damn!
In the words of some state legislator, spoken during a debate on a similar bill.....
If we, who are religious, are supposed to inherently hate people who are Gay, why does our God keep making more of them. At some point, maybe we should acknowledge that God knows what he's doing, and it is us who are wrong.
God also made sociopaths, pedophiles, alcoholics, thieves, murders and an abundance of other warped individuals. Using your argument, you want more of them too? Don't be misled by the latest PC angle that is being played to try to force acceptance of a choice of lifestyle or mutation of nature if you prefer.
Why do you falsely associate being born gay with illegal activities, or with disease states?
Is there any specific reason you choose to be ignorant about the science of se.xual orientation?
ok dude- every person you just listed- is a criminal because they violate the rights of others. as in they create victims. How are ga ys vioilating anyone elses rights? it is YOU- people like YOU- violating the rights of the ga ys- YOU are no different from the pedophiles...etc... YOU create victims. Equal rights is all they want. not special rights- EQUAL.
oppression- is not an American value I can support.
Redefining marriage to suit your LIFESTYLE does not a marriage make. Marriage is between one man and one woman. Just because you do not accept a tradition that has lasted for thousands of years does not give you the right to change that tradition. You want society to accept a social experiment that has devastating consequences for society. There are many places in the world that have undergone this social experiment and they are morally bankrupt. If you like, move there and be happy.
"Acquiring" children–and yes, "acquiring" children to suit your so-called marriage, does not make you a family. It is abusive to the children that you acquired to satisfy YOUR SELFISH DESIRE to be something you are NOT and NEVER WILL BE.
HERE'S an idea: LIVE LIKE YOU REALLY ARE FOR ONE DAY without trying to FORCE yourself onto the rest of society. Hm–In other words, stop raping our Christian morals and stop forcing us to comply! If you have a bible, read MACABEES 1 & 2–it's a good heartwarming read for the Christians too.
We all sin babycakes, but not all of us are PROUD of it. Most of us with a moral code try even to avoid it and people like you.
Decent Christians have left you alone. YOU DO NOT leave us alone. BULLIES! If Virginians have said NO then shut up and move to California or somewhere that you can live your FANTASY LIE–but oh wait, Californians SAID NO too. Oh, but wait, you FORCED YOURSELF ON US HERE TOO. Perhaps you should move to Canada or Sweden or something before the revolt starts.
So you say there are social consequences to gay marriage?
Liar. You're a liar. A bald faced out and out liar. What are they? Where can we see them? I notice you didn't mention a single one, a place where we can see these, etc. You, sir, are a liar.
And your god hallucinations about Maccabees are irrelevant. Your god is the father of lies, as you, sir, are yourself a liar. Your god of hate is your god. you're welcome to him, liar. Your perversions are your own illness. Your hatred is your own evil. You have NO right to destroy others' lives because of your sick god perversions
And you, sir, are a liar.
Yo Bobby, MRS=MARRIED WOMAN.
YO Lunatic! I noticed you didn't answer the issue. You're still a liar, aren't you? WHERE ARE THE CONSEQUENCES?
There are none.
Yo Bob-a–reno, really? You called me a "sir" throughout your post. You can't even read what I have written. Why would I bother explain a complex issue to you?
How much of a liar's lies do I have to read to know you're a liar?
Go ahead. Dodge your lies. It merely proves you admit you're a liar
You are seriously ignorant and misinformed. I pity you.
Hm. Pity. Okay. LOL.
A REAL MRS.: You are so full of crap! Do you listen to yourself? What a bunch of falsehoods and ignorant blathering. The country will be a better place when people who think like you become extinct.
A second Holocaust you suggest? You prove my point.
He suggests that the country would be better off without radical religious people attempting to work their values into government, and the first thought that pops into your head is the holocaust? Really? So when criticized, murder is the first idea that comes to mind? I don't know who's head needs to be examined here.
What a disgusting hate-filled Christian you are! I don't know what Christian bible you use, but 99.9% of them don't have the books of the Maccabees in them. Second, the word "marriage" didn't come around until the 15th century; before that, even the bible never mentioned marriage – it was a "union" between two people. A marriage between a man and a woman does not ensure that children will be raised in a "love filled" home with no abuse either. "Decent Christians" PRAY for those who are "sinning", such as yourself, with your hate for other people and your judgement.
It's amazing how often the words 'hate filled' and "Christian' appear together. At this point it's almost a redundancy. What a tragic religion. I know there are plenty of 'decent' Christians but this world would be much better off without the hate your religion inspires.
LOL.You don't even know what a Christian is... A Christian is a FOLLOWER OF CHRIST. Oh, and you are SOOO missing a good read.
Christ was a moron and you're created in his image
@ a real mrs...you call yourself a Christian, you holier-than-thou devoutee? You, have the right to judge someone and decide who's going to be a family?
That's the problem with people like you who think that your religion gives you God-like tendancies. A book written by man gives you such a superior feeling to use cruel words like "shut up" and "raping" like you are wonderful.
You are hateful, cruel and so "un-Christian" like and you are one of many reasons people reject organized religion. If God exists, then he made EVERYBODY, including the people you so disdain. Get off your high horse. And remember...what goes around comes around.
YES! Thank you! I am trying to be perfect like my Father. But I am only trying... SO HAPPY TO BE TRYING!!! Oh and my Father... I LOVE HIM!!!
P.S. I don't believe in Karma. I BELIEVE IN ONE GOD.
Yeah. The god of lies. MRS is a liar. Claiming that there are 'social consequences' to gay marriage she named precisely
none.
Then according to your good book...you sin in the way you judge and the way you hate. Decidedly "un-Christlike". You are choosing to sin, you hypocrite. And you, like I, like all...are far from perfect.
So take your put-downs, your hypocricy, your judgements, your fear...put it into the context it belongs. Your reflection. The perfection you think you seek under the guise of Christ is a mask of hate.
The consequence number one is suicides. Just last week one of your kind jumped of a bridge.
Lasting "thousands of years" does not validate something that is wrong. Slavery is a "tradition" that has "lasted thousands of years." Women being unable to vote was a "tradition" that "lasted thousands of years." Female genital mutilation is a "tradition" that has "lasted thousands of years."
Have you, A REAL MRS, ever said the Pledge of Allegiance to the flag? If you have, you may remember that it ends with the words "with liberty and justice for all." Perhaps it is time for you to re-evaluate ever uttering that Pledge again. Or, if you prefer, the next time you say it you should loudly and proudly say, for all to hear, "with liberty and justice for all the people I personally approve of," or something to that effect, since that is how you really feel.
"ONE NATION UNDER GOD" Love this part.
"Under God was added in 1954, 62 years after the Pledge was written. Not originally part of the Pledge
A REAL MRS. – You replied to my post about the Pledge of Allegiance by referring to "one nation under God." Okay, yes, that's in there all right. But what you didn't do was respond to my question about "with liberty and justice for ALL." Do you believe in liberty and justice for all, or just liberty and justice for SOME?
Speaking as a Virginian, I'm outraged that my representatives failed to represent my position on this issue. You can count on not receiving my vote next time around!
LOL! This poor female is laughably ignorant. She pretends "social consequences" but, well, clams up when asked to show any. In reality, all she wants is to keep others from having what she has. It's nothing but raw bigotry at it's worst.
Don't blame the Lord for your hate, you are just a bigot.
I too am married to a man, for 10 years, however I support the right of gays to marry. I feel it is you who are defining marriage to fit your own beliefs and lifestyle. There have been varied family structures in the history of mankind.
When I married my husband I was so excited and proud for everyone to know that we had chosen each other, out of all of the people in the world, to be with forever. I felt like we were declaring to everyone that were were related, that we were responsible for each other. I am still so happy and proud to be married to him.
My love for my husband was not based on reproduction, we have a beautiful perfect baby son but reproduction was clearly not the main reason I married my husband. Why could a gay couple not feel all of these things also? Why are you unable to sympathize?
MARRIAGE is between 2 consenting adults. regardless of their gender. wake up.
You're the one living in the dark ages. You wake up.
I totally misread your post. Ignore what I just said!
I completely agree with that. Who cares what peoples gender is, if they love each other, let them get married.
Please do one of the follow to validate your point:
1) Prove that marriage is between a man and a woman only legally without resorting to the Bible.
2) Explain why, if the law should reflect only the Christian perspective, athiests (or other non-Christians), old people (beyond child bearing age), and infertile couples (incapable of reproducing) are allowed to marry under current legislation, yet gays (incapable of reproducing) cannot.
LOL, talking about "morally bankrupt," you need not look farther than the "prophets" of the christian bible.
Marriage is historically between ONE man and ONE woman? Apparently you do not know history or the Bible for that matter very well.
I read a lot of the comments that are written on different subjects. It seems to me that the religious opinion is the most bigoted. I sugest you read the Bible and judge not lest you be judge, love your neighbors and quit spilling your hate. I support anyone that will help children, be gay, straight, black, green or purple. I don't care what they do in their bedrooms, I really don't want to know. When are we as a Country going to accept that not all people are the same and we are better for it.
You sound just like those that justified keeping Blacks as 2nd class citizens about 60 or so years ago. You've just found a new group to spew your hatred at. You and the rest of our christian Taliban are a true drain on the greatness that our country could be.
Mrs. Real How many foster children do you and a and your little minded corhorts have I bet NONE!!!
My great grandmother was the greatest women and most devote Christan I ever have known. Even I think she would smack you in the face for spreading your hate.
Using religion as a weapon to insult what you don't like isn't Christian. How are you following Christ? Read through your post again and imagine that being written by Jesus. Being a Christian is about following the example of love (and acceptance) that Jesus had for all kinds of people. He may not have agreed with the way some of the people he encountered lived their lives, but he let them know they were loved. Your comments are filled with judgement and self-righteousness, not love.
"Decent Christians have left you alone. YOU DO NOT leave us alone."
Yep. I remember the day when my gay brethren and sisters all mounted efforts to deny you and your fellow straight people the basic stability of being able to marry. And I remember when we made it legal to deny you housing and jobs because you are straight.
And I remember when we went out looking for perceived straight people to taunt, beat, and kill.
Yep. That was the day....
Oh, wait. None of that happened.
Instead, a small group of straight people have done ALL of those things to gay people.
So much for leaving people alone.
Hey, guys, this is just a troll trying to bait you. Doubtful they're even Christian OR female. Just some 16 year old with nothing better to do. Or some 30-something year old with a boring job. Ignore the troll.
I think you are drunk. I'm calling you out. Have you been drinking? Seriously.
So- without name calling, without getting defensive. I just want to know if you can list these consequences?
When you are recruiting other fear mongerors & liars, you might want to have at least an arguement to support your statements. Name calling and using CAPS to make your point...my kids do that..
The Virginia bill ignores my family too and I don't even live there. What's up with that anyway?
I think it's important to note that the area that they are currently living in is very different from the rest of the conservative VA. I spent 26 years there and watched it move from a red state to a red state with a few important blue counties. Fairfax county is an amazing place to raise children. The schools are top notch and the area is flourishing. I don't think it's fair to say they should have stayed away just because of the rediculous conservatism that seems to be becoming more rampent. They should be welcomed with open arms and appreciated for adopting like every other adoptive parent is.
It is strange that you consider yourselves conservative though I guess it wouldn't be considered strange if you were strait and being gay doesn't necessarily make you any more open minded or liberal than a strait person. I hope you didn't actually vote for the narcissus also know as McDonnell because if you did, then this really shouldn't be a surprise.
I was instantly struck that you couple a number of virtues – flourishing, great schools etc. with it being a pocket of blue in an otherwise red state. Which states consistently rank higher for quality of life? Which states consistently rank higher in educational achievement? Which states on average have more money go to the fed govmt than they receive? The blue ones. When will people get a clue and connect the dots? Nevermind I know the answer to that – good schools, good health, vibrant communities are all elitist. The answer is to dive for the bottom and drown everyone else in the process.
I can't help it, as a gay man myself, how does any gay person support the conservative party....ever!?!
I hate to say this, but honestly, you supported the conservative political causes that led your state to this decision....essentially, you are to blame for your own situation and as much as I feel badly for your children I can't say I have as much sympathy for you since you seem to proudly support causes that directly and specifically make your lives, and mine, harder.
You could always move to a more enlightened state, but please don't consider Washington if you're going to continue supporting people and causes that are not in your best interest.
QS, I was just wondering the same thing. Allso, I suspect that if they weren't gay themeselves, they would be opposed to the lifestyle and they would make it a point to vote against it.
That is an appallingly ridiculous assumption. Just because the word 'conservative' appears ONCE in the article? What a joke.
Based on what knowledge Howard? How can you say something that stupid...
...once is enough. If that's how the people are in that state...forget them already.
I kind of agree with you. I have often wondered why people of minority groups (those who are legal and illegal) support the conservative party. I imagine it has something to do with the governmental values that are attractive to people. I, myself, am a Democrat, very liberal! But, I understand that we all believe that the government should be run by "the people for the people". In that case, why are we still pushing our "religious morals" onto others. Why are religious based laws even being passed?
Not every issue in the conservative party is a social issue and not every social issue is about gays. Perhaps these people are against abortion. Perhaps they are for a smaller federal government. Perhaps they would like to see lower taxes for wealthy job creators. Maybe they want less gun control.
Not everyone out there agrees with every single thing that a party stands for. Some people have liberal social views and conservative economic views. You have to decide for yourself how important each issue is to you and make a decision. If you try to look for a political candidate who holds every single view that you have, you'll never have anyone to vote for.
Yet another Hate State. The Republiban are eager to push North Carolina into that category as well. Keep in mind, these are the same hypocrites who warn about Sharia law and are now imposing their own theocracies. Ignorance and hate rules.
Go back to CA. Apparently, Virginia rather have pedophiles and child murderers to take care of children than loving gay couples.Their loss!
I read this and I didn't follow. What right are you denied? You giving up the foster children? Or, you aren't losing anything but want to be recognized as a married couple cause it sounds cool to you. You don't need a government to tell you who you are.
The author personally will not be denied anything because his sons are already legally adopted, but other gay couples in the state will no longer be allowed to adopt. He's not focusing on his own loss, but rather the loss of other loving couples that now cannot adopt as well as the children who will spend the rest of their lives in foster care because loving families are legally banned fro adopting them. It's called empathy.
You obviously do not understand the item you are commenting on. The bill would prohibit adoption for gay couples in the future. Got it now? This is not a selfish item, as your perspective requires.
Actually, the bill does not "prohibit" adoption by gay couples as you say, it merely gives adoption service providers that option of not placing a child with a any person if doing so would put them at odds with their moral convictions.
I'm afraid it will always be the "Old" Dominion. As in Living in the past. I always remember the joke "How many Virginians does it take to change a light bulb?" 4; 1 to change the bulb and 3 to discuss how good the old one was.
I remember when you could not buy "Billy Beer" in Virginia because it was named after a 'living" person. That really made people feel safe!! Also could not have any Steak & Ale restaurants in Va ( was not allowed to have booze in name of restaurant ).
Get with the times Virginia
My husband and I adopted two children in California and were married during the window in which our marriages were legally recognized. When we decided to leave California, the FIRST thing we did was look at locations which would protect and accept our family structure.
While I sympathize with your situation, and the thousands of children to be left in limbo in that state, does it occur to you that you brought it on yourselves? Supporting conservative causes? Moving to a place where you knew you would have difficulty?
Move to Maryland, they are doing everything here to recognize the importance of my family, which is a lot like yours.
I guess Virginia squeezed this in along with their attacks on women. Shame on you, Virginia. I don't see the people of your legislature adopting any of these children in need. Ah, well. Let's just create more maladjusted young adults and adults with no idea of what a parent's love feels like.
Welcome to the All-American family.
What a well written article, James and Daniel. Was just a bit disappointed at the jab at "straight people who are not ready to be parents." I'm sure if gay people had the ability to procreate some irresponsible gay people would have children who would end up in the foster care system.
I think you are being a bit sensitive. I (a straight person) didn't take that as a jab at straight people at all. It was put very diplomatically, actually.
I agree. I am straight and did not see that as a slur or insult. And I do much volunteer work with teens and see firsthand how many truly are "not ready to be parents."
Gay: it's in their genes, they were born that way, they can't help it.
Transgender: It's in their genes, they were born that way, they can't help it.
Pedophile: Degenerate! Throw him in jail! Kill him!
Get the point?
The difference is pedophiles prey on children who have no say or way to protect themselves. Gays and Transgenders enter relationships with other adults of similar interests and can choose their path in life.
Get the point?
So, you do think that there are people who "chose" to be attracted to children (after becoming an adult, that is)? Isn't it that there are adults that, for some reason, are attracted to children and that some of them (that we call pedophiles) act on that devious attraction?
Are advocating for the better treatment of pedophiles?
No, actually, that makes no sense.
It is not a crime to BE a pedophile – it is a crime to act out your desires on a person before the age of consent. Get the difference? CONSENT? It's a pretty simple concept actually. Now...quit pushing YOUR religious views on the rest of the world without OUR consent. I'm not gay or trans...just a Jew who is sick of Christians acting like big bullies. YOUR attempts to push your religion into my laws feel like violation to me. I am no more happy with it than if you were pushing Islam...or even Judaism.
Big bob no i dont get your point? at all. is it hidden in your post?
You could always move out of Virginia. Maryland is just a 3-iron away and they let you do almost anything you want!
One should take a look at the entireity of the bills being rammed through the GA this year. Forget about unemployment, fiscal responsibility, and all the major woes that I thought were on the agenda. Social agendas are overtaking the spotlight, while peopl are trying to recover from the dark days of a deep recession. The focus is totally lost to what's important,rather the GA is going after the easy prey. Anyone tell these holier than thous that half of their flock is ending in divorce? I've sat in on some of these meetings, and one would really wonder what the mindset is. It certainly isn't logic.
I the "hate states'" the admonitions to Love Thy Neighbor" and such concepts as "Blessed are the Poor" and "Blessed are the Meek" and Blessed are the Peacemakers" (from the Guy's only actual sermon!) are ignored in favor of the theocratic positions adopted by the GOP and Fox News. How destructive to our religious tolerance based democracy. Roger Williams and Thomas Jefferson, Ben Franklin and John Adams–Deists all, and very committed to keeping religion out of politics and vice versa.
If they keep the electorate focused on hating others then hopefully they won't see how screwed up everything else is.
Wow I could barely finish this story without going through a box of Kleenex. Boo hoo, cry me a river. I am not, along with a lot of other people and the state government of VA, going to simply sit back and accept any perverted lifestyle just because people want to cram it down my throat.
Spoken like a true modern day all American "Christian". Really folks, when can we cut the bible belt loose from this union?
that will be the very same day we'll lose the Union altogether.
Nobody is doing anything of the kind to you. You are a bigoted control freak. You – and others like you – try to make people just like you, think like you. I am glad you are in the minority. Get over it simpleton, the time of you dinosaurs is just about over.
DH – Nobody is cramming anything down your throat. They just want to live a peaceful family life just like everyone else
Who is cramming this down your throat? No one is forcing you to live with them are they? So tell me how their "lifestyle" directly affects you?
Are you going to open your home and adopt these children, provide them with a loving and stable home? Are you going to convince others to do the same so we can wipe out the homeless children issue?
If not then how can you pretend your opinion matters? You are part of the problem, not the solution. When you put on your big boy pants and can grow up and be a real human being that is part of the resolution and not the problem come back and provide one.
But it's ok to shove your bigotry down the throats of those of us that aren't close minded and I'll informed like yourself?
No one is cramming anything down your throat. They are only demanding equal rights without the discrimination that people like you are forcing. This law allows for a completely STATE controlled program to have it's most major point of decision (the family selection process) be determined by personal or religious views, as opposed to a set of guidelines that must be met. They are allowing discrimination. BTW, this isn't the first time this has happened, and the old law (allowing registrars to determine whether or not a person is a capable voter in the years after desegregation circa 1965) was quickly overturned.
Maybe the problem is you support conservative causes. Talk about Karma in action!
Would the world only spend as much time trying to define itself by what it loves as it does defining itself by what it hates. Christians' Jesus did exactly that in his time, and yet modern Christians do exactly the opposite, living as the very Pharisees that Jesus preached against. It is absolutely disgusting.
I read today that the last true Christian died on a cross, and I'm very convinced it is true.
Just a gentle reminder that Jesus was born, lived and died as a Jew. Christianity was created by his disciples hundreds of years later. Not sure who the last true Christian was, but it was not the person who died on that cross.
"Virginia ignores my family?" The reason your so-called "family" is not recognized is because it is only a family in your own imagination. The same way your so-called "marriage" is in your imagination.
That is the most ignorant statement I have read all day. I will never understand how people can let some straight couples completely mock marriage with weddings lasting a few days and deny two gay men or women the right to live a loving marriage. And there are so many children out in the world that need a home, how is it right to deny these children the opportunity to grow up in a family just because someone doesn't agree with two adults lifestyle? I think that is horrible that Virginia would pass this bill.
Your statement comes in a close second.
Atilla the Hun- glad you named yourself appropriately. Obviously you are still stuck in the dark ages. I cannot WAIT until all of these bigots DIE OFF!
Bigoted control freak. Find your own happiness by not tearing others down. Hate mongrel.
The WHINING from these rednecks. It's precious watching these right wingers crying that they're being denied the right to oppress others because of some hallucination about god they've had.
They need to be burped and put to bed before they start thinking they're adults.
You know if people like you really want to deny the rights that should be granted to tax paying Americans, then maybe you should be willing to take more of the burden.
For example. let's say you and a gay man pay 25% in taxes because you are citizens and expect the same rights. But the gay gentleman has to give up his right to marry because of your view. He has lost those rights, so should he be forced to pay the same tax to live here? I think not, so let's reduce his tax to 10% and make yours 40% and it is a win-win for everyone.....up for it?
Most find it hard to hear the truth. They have been educated not on what's best for the children, but on what's best for gay people. Those two boys would rather be with a mom and a dad, not two gay dads. Whine all you want, boys don't want to have to defend that on the playground.
honey- you realize some Americans think your God is in YOUR imagination? Your religion is in YOUR imagination!
Just saying...it's ALL RELATIVE to the believer! Welcome to the "melting pot"